+ Reply to Thread
Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 1 2 3 LastLast
Results 11 to 20 of 26

Thread: No KAC rail for 416 planned

  1. #11
    Banned

    Join Date : Jul 2002
    Location : Kuwait
    Age : 40
    Posts : 1,014

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by The Stig View Post
    I'm not surprised KAC isn't making one. I think they hate piston ARs more than some people on this board hate chrome lining. I mean, first HK adds a forward assist to the 417, and now with this short stroke piston. If Eugene Stoner thought the AR should have had a piston, he would have made one with a piston. . . oh wait. . .
    HA!

    It's kinda funny how most people don't realize that the DI AR is in fact a piston gun.

    The only difference really between a "DI" AR and a "piston" HK416 is the location of the piston. Of course the location of the piston changes the dynamics of how the system works, but the fact of the matter is that they are still both "piston" operated systems.

    Honestly, I think the M-16/AR15 series of rifles would be better described as an "Internal piston" rifle rather then "direct impingment".

  2. #12
    Desperately Needs Treatment
    joehk's Avatar
    Join Date : Sep 2004
    Location : Texas
    Posts : 1,992

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by The Stig View Post
    I'm not surprised KAC isn't making one. I think they hate piston ARs more than some people on this board hate chrome lining. I mean, first HK adds a forward assist to the 417, and now with this short stroke piston. If Eugene Stoner thought the AR should have had a piston, he would have made one with a piston. . . oh wait. . .
    In all reality, KAC has probably made the decision based on market.
    There isn't a whole lot of MR556's out there and their not exactly flying off the shelves.
    Joe -

    Climb to Glory.

  3. #13
    Banned

    Join Date : Jul 2002
    Location : Kuwait
    Age : 40
    Posts : 1,014

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by joehk View Post
    In all reality, KAC has probably made the decision based on market.
    There isn't a whole lot of MR556's out there and their not exactly flying off the shelves.
    And you know this how?

    As it were, since I'd venture a guess that most of the aftermarket accessories for the 416 platform are being driven by Mil/LE end users anyway and that anything that trickles down to the Civ market is merely to generate extra cash flow to cover Christmas bonuses, your statement is invalid to begin with, much less backed by any sort of facts.

    Just sayin'.....

  4. #14
    HKPRO Professional
    pointblank4445's Avatar
    Join Date : Jun 2004
    Location : Midwest
    Posts : 4,138

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Grumpy View Post
    And you know this how?

    As it were, since I'd venture a guess that most of the aftermarket accessories for the 416 platform are being driven by Mil/LE end users anyway and that anything that trickles down to the Civ market is merely to generate extra cash flow to cover Christmas bonuses, your statement is invalid to begin with, much less backed by any sort of facts.

    Just sayin'.....
    I'm inclined to agree with Grumpy here. Consider some of the products KAC actually has introduced to the market. They have/had a NV mount of AI sniper rifles (Not much to go off there unless they get a contract with the Brits which I don't believe they have). While the MP5 and G3 RAS make sense, I don't know of many armies who have/had large amounts of 33's (save Malaysia) to warrant a 93/33 RAS, and MR556's should eclipse the 93 in production numbers.

  5. #15
    Banned

    Join Date : Jul 2002
    Location : Kuwait
    Age : 40
    Posts : 1,014

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by pointblank4445 View Post
    I'm inclined to agree with Grumpy here. Consider some of the products KAC actually has introduced to the market. They have/had a NV mount of AI sniper rifles (Not much to go off there unless they get a contract with the Brits which I don't believe they have). While the MP5 and G3 RAS make sense, I don't know of many armies who have/had large amounts of 33's (save Malaysia) to warrant a 93/33 RAS, and MR556's should eclipse the 93 in production numbers.
    Agreed.

    Another product to consider is the railed forend for the G36. Why make one? Because the G36 has been adopted by several countries as their primary military small arm and there was the possibility of scoring large govt. contracts.

    Had the G36 only ever been released as the sl-8 version, that product woudn't even have been considered by KAC.

  6. #16
    HKPRO Professional
    SDduc996's Avatar
    Join Date : Jun 2007
    Age : 40
    Posts : 1,132

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by pointblank4445 View Post
    I'm inclined to agree with Grumpy here. Consider some of the products KAC actually has introduced to the market. They have/had a NV mount of AI sniper rifles (Not much to go off there unless they get a contract with the Brits which I don't believe they have). While the MP5 and G3 RAS make sense, I don't know of many armies who have/had large amounts of 33's (save Malaysia) to warrant a 93/33 RAS, and MR556's should eclipse the 93 in production numbers.
    The Turks, though it's probably an MKE.

  7. #17
    Desperately Needs Treatment
    joehk's Avatar
    Join Date : Sep 2004
    Location : Texas
    Posts : 1,992

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Grumpy View Post
    And you know this how?

    As it were, since I'd venture a guess that most of the aftermarket accessories for the 416 platform are being driven by Mil/LE end users anyway and that anything that trickles down to the Civ market is merely to generate extra cash flow to cover Christmas bonuses, your statement is invalid to begin with, much less backed by any sort of facts.

    Just sayin'.....

    It's an educated guess, based on usage numbers/economies of scale and many factors. One of those factors are:
    When you build proprietary systems, the adaption of after market accessories is much less likely and prohibitively more expensive to design and manufacture.
    Assuming the 416/556 design for the front rail is similar, the economies of scale are just not there for a KAC to spend the time and resources on such a propriety platform for the small market it is, compared to the M4/6920 platform.

    Aftermarket accessories in the US firearms industry are more driven by consumers than mil sales, especially in days of government and defense budget cuts.
    The US consumer bought 14 million gun in 2009.

    Total estimates to equip 500,000 soldiers (US infantry #s) are in the 1billion $$ range. The economies of scale are not even close.

    USA Buys 14 Million+ Guns In 2009 - More Than 21 of the Worlds Standing Armies

    The USA’s M4 Carbine Controversy
    "The positions were, and are, clear. The US Army says the M4 isn’t broken, and adds that an Army-wide fix would cost $1 billion."

    There were 6 rifles manufactured by Heckler and Koch in the US in 2010, vs 11k+ for Colt defense.
    From the ATF numbers. 6 - MR556's?? ha! All protos no doubt.

    http://www.atf.gov/statistics/downlo...ort-report.pdf

    Many like to think the mil drives product development more than it actually does. The civilian and LE drives most development in the private sector companies. IS KAC competing for some mil contract to create these rails?
    For the players in the IC competition, the ultimate prize for being accepted is not government contracts, but the trickle down potential of being "the chosen one" for the US consumer market.
    Last edited by joehk; 02-04-2012 at 01:12 PM.

  8. #18
    Desperately Needs Treatment
    joehk's Avatar
    Join Date : Sep 2004
    Location : Texas
    Posts : 1,992

    Default

    Looking at their accessories page, I'd venture to guess the sales of NV and M29 mounts etc are very small volume compared to rails, sights etc.
    All the rest can be adapted to civilian carbines.

    I'd also venture to guess, Knight didn't get in the "business" to immediately start fulfilling mil contracts.

    Knight's Armament Company, RAS, Rail Adapter Systems, UK SAS, KAC, M4 Carbine, M5 RAS, URX, M4 Carbine RAS

  9. #19
    HKPRO Professional
    SDduc996's Avatar
    Join Date : Jun 2007
    Age : 40
    Posts : 1,132

    Default

    I thought Knight designed and built those rails after seeing our SOF guys with flashlights taped to their weapons.

  10. #20
    Desperately Needs Treatment
    joehk's Avatar
    Join Date : Sep 2004
    Location : Texas
    Posts : 1,992

    Default

    I didn't know that. My bad, KMC division is responsible for civilian stuff.

+ Reply to Thread
Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 1 2 3 LastLast

Links

 

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts

Search tags for this page

carbine piston rail kac
,
hk g36 knight's armament rail adapter
,
hk416 and knights suppressor
,

hk416 kac rail

,
kac hk416
,
kac onsucha
,
kac piston rail adaptor
,

knights armament

,
knights armament drive system
,
knights hk rail for sale
,
piston kit with kac rail
,

urx ii on hk416

Click on a term to search for related topics.