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Thread: Bavarian Police to adopt HK SFP9

  1. #51
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    German Police may not own any private firearms unless they have a privat permit, either as a hunter (Jagdschein) or as a sportsman (Waffenbesitzkarte). The service weapon does not belong to them, it belongs to their police dept.

    Some police officers take their service weapons home, where they are supposed to be stored securely. As far as carrying their service weapons around off duty... I think that would be a special circumstance requiring special authorization. Your normal beat cop isn't armed off duty. There are certainly special units, for which other rules apply.

    I would be very surprised if any German police officer is allowed to carry a privately owned firearm (other than during a shooting contest or while hunting) unless they had a -Waffenschein- listing that weapon. Your normal Policeman (or woman) has zero chance of obtaining a Waffenschein. Zero. There may be, I say may be, some higher Police officials who are deemed at such a risk that they may have a Waffenschein, but I'd be surprised. They would have personal protection. I don't even want to think of the trouble that would occur if any official here used a personally owned firearm to shoot anyone.

  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by P30 View Post
    That's not quite what I was told by a federal police officer ("Bundespolizist"). He is allowed to carry his service pistol (HK P30 V2) when he is off duty. He carries it concealed. He is allowed to take it home and stores it in a safe there.

    What I agree to: If he wants to have an additional pistol, then he is equal to a normal citizen.

    My cousin is a police officer (state police) here in Germany. I will ask her next time, if she is allowed to take her Walther P99 home and to carry it off duty.

    Looks to me like that's exactly what you were told: Police must have a private permit to own a private firearm... their service weapon is not their property anymore than the police car is theirs.

  3. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wilmersdorfer View Post
    German Police may not own any private firearms unless they have a privat permit, either as a hunter (Jagdschein) or as a sportsman (Waffenbesitzkarte).
    Or a collectors license.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wilmersdorfer View Post
    As far as carrying their service weapons around off duty... I think that would be a special circumstance requiring special authorization. Your normal beat cop isn't armed off duty.
    I'll ask my guy about this. Perhaps there is a reason he didn't carry the issue P7 off duty. But I am not blowing smoke up your fourth point of contact about him carrying a G26 off duty, I have visited him many times and seen this with my own eyes every time I visited. He's only been retired for 6 months.

    I would not be surprised if there were different rules in different states.

    I actually know where Wilmersdorf is, I spent 2 years living "right down the road" from you at McNair Kaserne on Goerzallee, and in early 1981 two GI's in my unit who suffered from the delusion that they were back home in the ghetto they came from decided it would be a good idea to start mugging German civilians at knife point. They picked an off-duty West Berlin Police Officer in civilian clothes. The one with the knife got shot. Unfortunately he didn't die.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wilmersdorfer View Post
    I would be very surprised if any German police officer is allowed to carry a privately owned firearm (other than during a shooting contest or while hunting) unless they had a -Waffenschein- listing that weapon. Your normal Policeman (or woman) has zero chance of obtaining a Waffenschein. Zero. There may be, I say may be, some higher Police officials who are deemed at such a risk that they may have a Waffenschein, but I'd be surprised. They would have personal protection. I don't even want to think of the trouble that would occur if any official here used a personally owned firearm to shoot anyone.
    Like I said.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Wilmersdorfer View Post
    Looks to me like that's exactly what you were told: Police must have a private permit to own a private firearm... their service weapon is not their property anymore than the police car is theirs.
    You appear to be ignoring that he was also told the guy carries it off duty.
    "We do bad things to bad people".

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  5. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wilmersdorfer View Post
    Police officers here in Germany are not even allowed to privately own firearms unless they have also obtained a license just the same as any other citizen. Service arms are not theirs to give or sell.
    Quote Originally Posted by Wilmersdorfer View Post
    German Police may not own any private firearms unless they have a privat permit, either as a hunter (Jagdschein) or as a sportsman (Waffenbesitzkarte). The service weapon does not belong to them, it belongs to their police dept.

    Some police officers take their service weapons home, where they are supposed to be stored securely. As far as carrying their service weapons around off duty... I think that would be a special circumstance requiring special authorization. Your normal beat cop isn't armed off duty. There are certainly special units, for which other rules apply.

    I would be very surprised if any German police officer is allowed to carry a privately owned firearm (other than during a shooting contest or while hunting) unless they had a -Waffenschein- listing that weapon. Your normal Policeman (or woman) has zero chance of obtaining a Waffenschein. Zero. There may be, I say may be, some higher Police officials who are deemed at such a risk that they may have a Waffenschein, but I'd be surprised. They would have personal protection. I don't even want to think of the trouble that would occur if any official here used a personally owned firearm to shoot anyone.
    Not -quite - right, at least for Bavaria and plainclothes detectives. That‘s at least what I was told by the head of my dojo, a plainclothes detective (Hauptkommissar) working in organised crime, narcotics and later homicide. He told me that after he finished police academy he -as the other detectives- was issued a concealed carry permit (Waffenschein) by his PD. This was meant as a means of self protection for him and his family when off duty. He did take his P7 home, but had to store it in a safe next to his (private) 3“ S&W 586, which he carried concealed off duty, when he felt the need.
    Could be a specifically Bavarian thing.
    A colleague, who was a police officer in his ‚former life‘, was offered to buy his former service pistol when his department switched to P7s, before he left the police. Although he didn‘t have a carry permit after leaving the police...
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  6. #55
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    Detectives (Kripo) And SEK special units are not the same as regular beat cops. They operate under other regulations. The main police force are the beat cops.

  7. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by 3two8 View Post
    Not -quite - right, at least for Bavaria and plainclothes detectives.........He did take his P7 home, but had to store it in a safe next to his (private) 3“ S&W 586, which he carried concealed off duty, when he felt the need.....Could be a specifically Bavarian thing....
    You may be right, notice that this describes exactly what my guy did, takes P7 home, stores in safe, carries personally owned handgun concealed off duty.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wilmersdorfer View Post
    Detectives (Kripo) And SEK special units are not the same as regular beat cops. They operate under other regulations. The main police force are the beat cops.
    My guy worked the streets in uniform. Not Kripo, not SEK.

  8. #57
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    Blah blah blah WHERE ARE THESE P7s!!!???
    Hokey religions and ancient weapons are no match for a good blaster at your side, kid.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bastardsonofelvis View Post
    Blah blah blah WHERE ARE THESE P7s!!!???
    In limbo.

  10. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lamont View Post
    In limbo.
    Better than straight to the furnace...

    Seriously: most are still in the holsters of their users and will get phased out as the SFP9-TRs become available.
    And then they will collect dust in a bin in the corner of the armory, until someone in charge makes up their mind, what to do.
    Mind you: not whether to sell them, but whether to throw them into the smelter right or (more likely) whether to separate plastic and metal(s) before. You know us germans are serious about sorting out garbage ... 🤪
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  11. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by 3two8 View Post
    You know us Germans are serious about sorting out garbage ...
    Yes I do......

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