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Thread: VP9 and VP9L Optic Ready!

  1. #181
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    Quote Originally Posted by YVK View Post
    @farmerbrown : I was being sarcastic, mostly towards apologetic attitudes to HK on this site. They published an OR on their European site over two years ago, obviously without testing it appropriately before that. Otherwise they wouldn't have had to re-design it for a more robust setup before the release, as we were told on this site. They still haven't delivered it. This isn't a superior engineering, this is an incompetence and/or lack of resources.
    I'm 100% with you. I know we cut HK some slack in this place. But I've had a -OR on order for over 12 months, and I just wonder why long slide was higher priority (cutouts or not)?

  2. #182
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    Quote Originally Posted by farmerbrown View Post
    I'm 100% with you. I know we cut HK some slack in this place. But I've had a -OR on order for over 12 months, and I just wonder why long slide was higher priority (cutouts or not)?
    The L is safe and didn’t take much engineering. They can throw the American market a bone, perhaps help their shooting team and some dude that want to compete with their VP9.

    It’s easy, and I’m not sure why it took so long.

    The OR takes real engineering, so much that they’ve evidently failed and gone back to the drawing board, or they simply aren’t funding it.


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  3. #183
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    Quote Originally Posted by farmerbrown View Post
    I've had a -OR on order for over 12 months, and I just wonder why long slide was higher priority (cutouts or not)?
    Hopefully they are over-engineering the optics plate.
    But also, I'm sure the market demand is stronger for the L than it is for the the the OR model(s).

    While I certainly think red dots have their application (like Shot Dr.s on Open guns), and the market for "OR" cheap defensive pistols is large and growing, it is still "niche". Like most everyone (every single person) I've spoken to born in the '80s or before, it takes me a lot longer to get a first shot off with a red dot. I also have difficulty with shots at different ranges. This could certainly be overcome with practice; but why? My personal choice is not to CCW an "OR" type weapon. I don't feel like this needs explanation on this forum.

    To be quite frank, HK loyalists just aren't as into video games as many who've been Gucci Glucked. When I told my younger shooting buddy that the VP-ORs were on the way, he said he would only be interested in a VP9T-OR. This makes sense to me as you can add all of the COD mods--it's even got a rail for a VFG in the front after he unlocks AOW ability at level 62. Then he'll be waiting eagerly for a laser guide rod.
    I would be remise if I didn't mention that the same kid out-shot me last ZSA match using a Sig with an optic. He is an excellent shooter, though, and would have shot just as well with a stock VP9.
    YMMV, and that's cool.

    Side note; I wish the slide cutouts... weren't.
    2 + 2 = 4, whether you know how to count or not.

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  5. #184
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    Video from SHOT Show 2019:


  6. #185
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    Quote Originally Posted by Disregarded9-side View Post
    Hopefully they are over-engineering the optics plate.
    But also, I'm sure the market demand is stronger for the L than it is for the the the OR model(s).

    While I certainly think red dots have their application (like Shot Dr.s on Open guns), and the market for "OR" cheap defensive pistols is large and growing, it is still "niche". Like most everyone (every single person) I've spoken to born in the '80s or before, it takes me a lot longer to get a first shot off with a red dot. I also have difficulty with shots at different ranges. This could certainly be overcome with practice; but why? My personal choice is not to CCW an "OR" type weapon. I don't feel like this needs explanation on this forum.

    To be quite frank, HK loyalists just aren't as into video games as many who've been Gucci Glucked. When I told my younger shooting buddy that the VP-ORs were on the way, he said he would only be interested in a VP9T-OR. This makes sense to me as you can add all of the COD mods--it's even got a rail for a VFG in the front after he unlocks AOW ability at level 62. Then he'll be waiting eagerly for a laser guide rod.
    I would be remise if I didn't mention that the same kid out-shot me last ZSA match using a Sig with an optic. He is an excellent shooter, though, and would have shot just as well with a stock VP9.
    YMMV, and that's cool.

    Side note; I wish the slide cutouts... weren't.
    Plenty of older shooters, including myself, are appreciative of the RDS. It’s quite helpful for aging eyes.


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  7. #186
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    Quote Originally Posted by redpillregret View Post
    I won’t judge a book by its cover. But I think there are major benefits to the ACRO. If they pan out I will be giving up my RMRs.


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    Sorry to wander off topic again but...

    I'm curious, what are the major benefits you see over a RMR? I don't know much about the ACRO so I'm really asking. Does it do something other than project a red dot? I looks bulkier and heavier but with a smaller window and probable tube effect. Based on APs other products I'm guessing it will be more expensive too.

    I'm just not seeing why one would go through the hassle and expense to ditch RMRs already in use and acquire ACROs.

    I've had RMRs that suffer under recoil, but they've taken a trip back to Trijicon and came back in working order -- perhaps that reliability issue is it?
    Hokey religions and ancient weapons are no match for a good blaster at your side, kid.

  8. #187
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    Quote Originally Posted by redpillregret View Post
    Plenty of older shooters, including myself, are appreciative of the RDS. It’s quite helpful for aging eyes.
    Good to know, I hadn't thought about an RDS for that application. Makes sense.
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  9. #188
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    Quote Originally Posted by bastardsonofelvis View Post
    Sorry to wander off topic again but...

    I'm curious, what are the major benefits you see over a RMR? I don't know much about the ACRO so I'm really asking. Does it do something other than project a red dot? I looks bulkier and heavier but with a smaller window and probable tube effect. Based on APs other products I'm guessing it will be more expensive too.

    I'm just not seeing why one would go through the hassle and expense to ditch RMRs already in use and acquire ACROs.

    I've had RMRs that suffer under recoil, but they've taken a trip back to Trijicon and came back in working order -- perhaps that reliability issue is it?
    Here are the benefits I see:

    1. Durability. It was designed from the ground up for riding a pistol slide, unlike the RMR (even the type 2 is a modified type 1 that was never meant to rise a slide). RMRs are more durable than the other common pistol-optics we see but it’s not on the level of any of the Aimpoint tube-style optics.

    2. Battery changes without losing zero from removing the optic. That is a thing.

    3. It’s a sealed unit, therefore the diode is protected from mud, dust, skin cells, water, etc.

    4. The exposed lenses are going to be replaceable while the inner lenses are sealed. This will provide protection to the important lenses while the outer are...say think of a sacrificial lens ala PVS14. This is said to be an affordable factory service. Scratches happen to RMRs.

    5. A better mounting system. It will be mounted by clamping as opposed to screwed down. From my experience, RMR screws are somewhat easy to have issues with, and having to take them on/off every six months makes it that much more likely to have an issue. My last battery change, I had to soak the screws for three days before they would budge due to rust.

    6. For defensive use, one can get away without a rear sight, allowing for an uncluttered view, simply by using the tube as if it were an aperture for the front sight.

    You say it looks “bulkier and heavier” but have job actually examined the measurements? It’s basically the same footprint, but it is a tube. It is 0.2 oz heavier than the Delta Point Pro.

    As far as “tube-effect” I’ve never experienced this with any optic. I have typically run both eyes open and the tube washes out. I see the target and a dot. If it’s not a problem with an M2 or a T1, I wouldn’t see this rig being an issue.




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  10. #189
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    Quote Originally Posted by redpillregret View Post
    Here are the benefits I see:

    1. Durability. It was designed from the ground up for riding a pistol slide, unlike the RMR (even the type 2 is a modified type 1 that was never meant to rise a slide). RMRs are more durable than the other common pistol-optics we see but it’s not on the level of any of the Aimpoint tube-style optics.

    2. Battery changes without losing zero from removing the optic. That is a thing.

    3. It’s a sealed unit, therefore the diode is protected from mud, dust, skin cells, water, etc.

    4. The exposed lenses are going to be replaceable while the inner lenses are sealed. This will provide protection to the important lenses while the outer are...say think of a sacrificial lens ala PVS14. This is said to be an affordable factory service. Scratches happen to RMRs.

    5. A better mounting system. It will be mounted by clamping as opposed to screwed down. From my experience, RMR screws are somewhat easy to have issues with, and having to take them on/off every six months makes it that much more likely to have an issue. My last battery change, I had to soak the screws for three days before they would budge due to rust.

    6. For defensive use, one can get away without a rear sight, allowing for an uncluttered view, simply by using the tube as if it were an aperture for the front sight.

    You say it looks “bulkier and heavier” but have job actually examined the measurements? It’s basically the same footprint, but it is a tube. It is 0.2 oz heavier than the Delta Point Pro.

    As far as “tube-effect” I’ve never experienced this with any optic. I have typically run both eyes open and the tube washes out. I see the target and a dot. If it’s not a problem with an M2 or a T1, I wouldn’t see this rig being an issue.




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    Some of those are solid advantages; others academic. Removing the RMR to replace batteries is a hassle, I'll give you that. I'd definitely consider the Aimpoint over a RMR for a new purchase, depending on disparity in price. I don't see any of those things being so huge as to make me want to replace functioning optics though, but different strokes...

  11. #190
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    If these pan out to be what they seem like they will, only my milled pistols will keep RMRs.


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