Low & Left: P-30SKs Back to HK - Page 2
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Thread: Low & Left: P-30SKs Back to HK

  1. #11
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    I had a P30SK and shot low left. I had a guy at the range shoot it and he shot it low right of course he was left handed. LOL. I ended up getting a couple of P30's with LEM and am pretty much dead on.

    I never could get used to the short grip on the SK.
    drshame, drshame and drshame like this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by reloader-1 View Post
    Have at least 2 other “good” shooters go through a mag or two before you send it back.

    Seen this story a few dozen times, it’s nearly always been user error. Good luck!
    I would recommend this. I agree with others above, when I hear low AND left, I think its the shooter. I would understand it if its low or high, or left or right, as maybe the sights are off, but both....
    The grip and the trigger pull on the P30 is a lot different than the other guns you compared them to shield w apex, sigs. I personally never liked the double action on them and all my P30s are light LEM. I much prefer the trigger pull on my vp9 (but I'm used to strikers) and for HKs prefer their single action match trigger (only available on the USP). Having owned many USPs in different calibres and sizes, even each USP type shoots a little differently.
    In regards to the SK in general, depending on your hand size that grip doesn't work as well because of how short it is. I've had some larger sized-hand friends have trouble with both the P30sk and the VP9sk.

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    I used to do this. A friend pointed me to this video. Cured my low left shots.

    Pay close attention to the part where he discusses trigger finger manipulation.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ysa50-plo48

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    Heyas DrShame!

    It's the shooter. Don't take that personally, I'm sure that you have a LOT of shooting experience. But not with a p30. The trigger pull on a p30 is a lot longer than what you are most likely accustomed to. Down and left when it is consistent, is a problem with the shooter, and their trigger pull. It took me years to correct mine.
    The most likely scenario is that you're expecting the break and the boom from your other guns, before the break and boom from a p30 with its longer pull. You can work with your grip panels, but mostly dry fire, and watch your trigger finger. With that longer pull, I'll bet your trigger pressure is pulling the gun down and left.

    ALSO- HKs, Walthers, FNs, a lot of newer pistols are zero'd using Euro 25 yards as the sight in. That means that they are sighted in to use 25 yards as point of aim. Anything less than that, and you need to compensate by holding your front sight, higher up on the target where you want to hit.
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    Some people whine that HK doesn't put things out fast enough -- the same people that whine when something is put out before it's perfect. Some people just like to whine.

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    low and left is almost always the shooter NOT the pistol or the sightsyou
    are pulling down and left which is just not obvious to you........
    every pistol has it's learning curve in my experience to shoot well,
    with a few exceptions of course.
    "All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing"
    Edmund Burke

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    Same thing happened to me with my P30. I've been shooting since the early 1970s. I'm pretty confident by now with my technique. After I bought my P30 I took it to the range and was dismayed that the gun seem to be shooting low and left. I was so convinced it was the gun that I was about to send it back. There's no way a shooter with my experience and time at the firing line could have a technical flaw without knowing it. Right before I sent it back I decided to give it one more try and this time I did it on a bench rest. The result was that the difficulty was mine. The gun wasn't shooting low and left. I was shooting low and left. That is a typical technical flaw from a right-handed shooter who is experiencing anticipation and compensation of recoil. The best remedy for that in my experience is what I call a snap cap drill. Go to the range with a friend. Have that friend load you are mags randomly with live rounds and snap caps. You are friend loads the mag into the gun and Chambers it. You take it from there. Likely the first time the mag feeds a snap cap into the chamber and you squeeze the trigger, you'll see what you're doing wrong.

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    Help appreciated Greatly.
    Will see how it patterns when it gets back from HK.
    Agreed I need more trigger time/training with it.
    I may well be spoiled by the triggers on the others....or need to re-think what accuracy that I need for a ccw/ easily concealed pistol.
    So far, since I got all the growing pains worked out on the Shield/Apex, it's Top Dog for my current needs.
    But I like the extra safety features of my P30SKs too much to give up and sell it.

    If you get a chance, try a Sig P-210 or a German Master Shop X5L1 for a very good trigger system in a factory-9mm platform. I'm spoiled!
    Last edited by drshame; 10-03-2018 at 04:06 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by drshame View Post
    ... or need to re-think what accuracy that I need for a ccw/ easily concealed pistol.
    There’s your quandary, you can’t eat the whole cake.
    Sure I can shoot my C/FS HK’s better, but they cannot beat my P30SKS in ultra–concealment.
    Regardless of trigger config/operation SC’s handle differently. Day 1 with my P30SKS and WT*, and I still need training at ~620rds on it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by drshame View Post
    Help appreciated Greatly.
    Will see how it patterns when it gets back from HK.
    Agreed I need more trigger time/training with it.
    I may well be spoiled by the triggers on the others....or need to re-think what accuracy that I need for a ccw/ easily concealed pistol.
    So far, since I got all the growing pains worked out on the Shield/Apex, it's Top Dog for my current needs.
    But I like the extra safety features of my P30SKs too much to give up and sell it.

    If you get a chance, try a Sig P-210 or a Herman Master Shop X5L1 for a very good trigger system in a factory-9mm platform. I'm spoiled!
    It's true, great triggers are a pleasure. I have some SIG mastershop, Colt Gold Cup tuned, HK Match triggers that could make the noobiest shooters look good. But, great triggers can also mask creeping technical problems that over time can become bad habits. I maintain that with proper technique, a shooter can shoot well with any trigger....even that of the VP70 lol

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    Quote Originally Posted by azimuth View Post
    Same thing happened to me with my P30. I've been shooting since the early 1970s. I'm pretty confident by now with my technique. ....That is a typical technical flaw from a right-handed shooter who is experiencing anticipation and compensation of recoil.
    Azimuth, you've hit the nail on the head, at least as far as why I myself have issues trying to shoot a p30 accurately. I've been shooting hammer fired pistols since I was 21. Which was the legal age to purchase. I've shot Berettas, I've shot USPs, I've shot a lot of different Taurus, SW, Rugers, etc. I was going to buy a p30 for my carry gun, and went to the range to try the out, before I finalized my purchase with the seller.
    I was pulling the trigger, and pulling the trigger, and pulling the trigger. I was wondering WHEN is this gun gonna SHOOT? Then when it finally DID, my shots were all over the place. I stopped, dropped the mag, and started doing some dry fire. That extended pull, had me pulling the gun off sight, because I wasn't used to having to pull the trigger THAT far back. That extended pull, was changing the way my trigger finger was putting leverage against the trigger, and it was pulling the gun off. THAT, combined with the fact that it WOULD fire, when I completely WAS NOT EXPECTING IT TO, would cause a slight flinch.
    It was not the gun, other than the difference in the pull. It was ME, because I wasn't USED to the pull.

    I bought a VP9 instead. Now that's NOT me saying that it was a bad gun. I still really like the p30 series, and I'm still in the market to start getting a couple of them, when I have money again. But NOT for a carry gun, because I don't want a carry piece that I have to RElearn how to shoot. Not for when an instinctual response could make it life or death for me.

    DrShame- I wouldn't go so far as to say that you're spoiled. I'd rather say that the trigger system is one that takes some learning, some retraining, and some adjustment. ESPECIALLY after so much use with an APEX system. Sadly, right now, there's nothing that we can do about the actual length of that pull, only the weight of it.

    Your post suggest that you have no problem with Striker fire guns. But that you're looking for one for carry that you have concerns with accidental discharge. I'm gonna go out on a limb, and say that IF you ever have a chance, don't pass up the opportunity to try out a Walther p99 AS or p99c AS. Or one of the clones of the p99 like the Smith&Wesson 99 or the Israeli R99 (the makers of the desert eagle, I for the life of me, can't remember what the company name was at the time!)
    The main difference between these models and a standard striker fired pistol is that you can load them up, put one in the chamber and then DECOCK the striker. The pistol will then NOT fire, until the trigger reaches the back of the trigger guard where the break point is.
    I own and have carried the p99c AS, and it's a great CCW pistol. It is smaller, and thinner than the VP9, so it's of somewhat (possibly smaller) dimension than the p30. While it doesn't have the manual safety, you still have the option of double action first shot, single action thru the rest of the mag. That feature also gives you double strike capability.
    Or carry in single action the entire time. NOW...in THAT case, you have 2 options. You can carry with the trigger entirely forward, which means that your first shot is going to be safer for carry because you have a longer pull before the break. Or, you can manually pull the trigger back until it clicks, and then the trigger will stay in position halfway thru the pull, making for a much shorter pull.
    From the factory, the trigger pull feels really light. In DA, it feels a lot like what a lot of people say the LEM trigger feels like. In SA mode, it literally feels so light that all you feel, is pushing a piece of plastic backwards, a lot like what you are probly used to, with your APEX.
    After your first shot, regardless of mode, the break and reset is so similar to that of a PPQ that you wouldn't be able to tell the difference in live fire.

    Pretty much the ONLY reason I prefer to carry my VP9sk over the p99c is because of the break point in the trigger. I love having the break point at the middle of the trigger guard, rather than at the end of it. It makes me shoot a lot better, and it's a lot easier for me to gauge when the pistol is gonna go bang.
    Ok...yeah....maybe we DO get spoiled by a trigger system, hahahaha.
    drshame, drshame and drshame like this.

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