Sear vs DLO? Information sought - Page 6
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Thread: Sear vs DLO? Information sought

  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by SudS View Post
    What is worth more? An unaltered DLO box, or a DLO box where the owner went out to his garage (after a lot of practice) and opened up the selector hole with their own tools?
    In addition to enlarging both sides of the ambidextrous selector holes, you also add a pair of rod holes to both sides of the frame (so 4 holes created, 2 enlarged). While one could attempt this mod on their own transferable frame (unlikely), to use a gunsmith will cost $500 to $2500, per frame. Factor in the rarity+cost of a transferable frame versus a sear, the fact that you can't use just any transferable frame, you must track down a specimen that is a viable candidate for this mod (location of serials & markings to be free of obfuscation post modification), cost of burst pack, round trip insured shipping, and the time involved to achieve this configuration, and you start to see the value of ambi compared to SEF for a transferable frame.

    Its not that they aren't out there. I've been told that Ralph of RDTS was converting SEF DLO frames to ambi in batches of 20 at one point, its just that what is being offered is usually in unmodified SEF (owners keeping their ambi packs perhaps?). Out of the 20 +/- transferable frames that I found for sale since August, 2015 (when my NFA stamp collecting began), only 2 were converted from SEF to ambi:
    1.) August, 2015: $38k for DLO in 4-pos w/ 3-rnd burst converted by RDTS + MP5K (SP89) host (RCM barrel) that was listed on subguns. Seller changed his mind and decided to keep, after I had agreed to buy at his full asking.
    2.) October, 2015: $30k for LaFrance in 4-pos w/ 2-rnd burst converted by Terry Dyer. Pack only and this was a new record sale price at the time. Seller wasn't in a hurry to let go of it, form 3 wasn't filed until 100+ days later. -source

    September, 2015: Then there was this transferable HTA frame in 4-pos ambi /w 3-rnd bust that allegedly started out in a full-auto frame instead of SEF, which was listed for sale for $35k by Capitol Ordnance (pack only, no host). Not sure what happened to it. Seller never responded after I agreed to buy at his full asking (I asked to see the form 3):


    Ultimately, I plan to have the following ambi pack trilogy built on transferable frames:


    I have the transferable LS packs x 3 secured. Just bought this ambi-Navy 3-pos pack today, so I suppose all that leaves is a new 4-pos /w 3-rnd burst pack as far as the parts are concerned. After the form 3s clear, I plan to have the mods performed while waiting on the form 4s, assuming that my local dealer is OK with that (iffy since I'm their first NFA customer).
    Hidden Content Hidden Content Hidden Content . Hidden Content 7/14/2016.
    Check cleared 7/18/2016. Approved 6/16/2017. Stamps delivered 7/6/2017.

  2. #52
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    NEO - that's going to be an impressive collection of trigger packs when done. Especially so when you consider it was done at 2016 prices as opposed to 1996 prices. You are going in big and making a big investment in things HK.
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  3. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Player_To_Be_Named... View Post
    NEO - that's going to be an impressive collection of trigger packs when done. Especially so when you consider it was done at 2016 prices as opposed to 1996 prices. You are going in big and making a big investment in things HK.

    You would really crap if you knew what he spent on his home theater speakers.

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  5. #54
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    I was really asking a rhetorical question. Would you want to buy a $30k+ trigger frame that was significantly modified by someone who doesn't work on guns for a living?


    Quote Originally Posted by Neo-Geo View Post
    In addition to enlarging both sides of the ambidextrous selector holes, you also add a pair of rod holes to both sides of the frame (so 4 holes created, 2 enlarged). While one could attempt this mod on their own transferable frame (unlikely), to use a gunsmith will cost $500 to $2500, per frame. Factor in the rarity+cost of a transferable frame versus a sear, the fact that you can't use just any transferable frame, you must track down a specimen that is a viable candidate for this mod (location of serials & markings to be free of obfuscation post modification), cost of burst pack, round trip insured shipping, and the time involved to achieve this configuration, and you start to see the value of ambi compared to SEF for a transferable frame.

    Its not that they aren't out there. I've been told that Ralph of RDTS was converting SEF DLO frames to ambi in batches of 20 at one point, its just that what is being offered is usually in unmodified SEF (owners keeping their ambi packs perhaps?). Out of the 20 +/- transferable frames that I found for sale since August, 2015 (when my NFA stamp collecting began), only 2 were converted from SEF to ambi:
    1.) August, 2015: $38k for DLO in 4-pos w/ 3-rnd burst converted by RDTS + MP5K (SP89) host (RCM barrel) that was listed on subguns. Seller changed his mind and decided to keep, after I had agreed to buy at his full asking.
    2.) October, 2015: $30k for LaFrance in 4-pos w/ 2-rnd burst converted by Terry Dyer. Pack only and this was a new record sale price at the time. Seller wasn't in a hurry to let go of it, form 3 wasn't filed until 100+ days later. -source

    September, 2015: Then there was this transferable HTA frame in 4-pos ambi /w 3-rnd bust that allegedly started out in a full-auto frame instead of SEF, which was listed for sale for $35k by Capitol Ordnance (pack only, no host). Not sure what happened to it. Seller never responded after I agreed to buy at his full asking (I asked to see the form 3):


    Ultimately, I plan to have the following ambi pack trilogy built on transferable frames:


    I have the transferable LS packs x 3 secured. Just bought this ambi-Navy 3-pos pack today, so I suppose all that leaves is a new 4-pos /w 3-rnd burst pack as far as the parts are concerned. After the form 3s clear, I plan to have the mods performed while waiting on the form 4s, assuming that my local dealer is OK with that (iffy since I'm their first NFA customer).

  6. #55
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    NEO pulled off something that many considered impossible... 3 LaFrance boxes out of all 170+- ever made.

  7. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neo-Geo View Post
    In addition to enlarging both sides of the ambidextrous selector holes, you also add a pair of rod holes to both sides of the frame (so 4 holes created, 2 enlarged). While one could attempt this mod on their own transferable frame (unlikely), to use a gunsmith will cost $500 to $2500, per frame.
    TPM will do it for $350.

  8. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by coolhand View Post
    NEO pulled off something that many considered impossible... 3 LaFrance boxes out of all 170+- ever made.
    With this 41F countdown, I do feel lucky to have found 3 sellers within short succession. Regarding rarity, Tim LaFrance checked his records and the last/final HK transferable that he registered was # 138. He also said, "There may be a few more but they would have been post sample by that time." This was all in writing by email correspondence, which IMO, is very handy information for us to have. Now if someone who's a DLO collector could convince Doug to reveal his records, we'd have a more complete picture of what's out there.

    @Renegade: I wasn't aware, but I've noticed that TPM seems to have the best prices in the industry. $350 is a price that matches what the master gunsmith Gerard Miller was offering for this conversion service. Though for this project, being that it's more of a one-way-trip for the frames, I'd shop by gunsmith for best results, not price. Kinda like shopping for lasik eye surgery, I'm not enticed by the surgical shine one eye and you get the next one free kinda deal.
    Last edited by Neo-Geo; 04-24-2016 at 11:08 PM.

  9. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neo-Geo View Post

    @Renegade: I wasn't aware, but I've noticed that TPM seems to have the best prices in the industry. $350 is a price that matches what the master gunsmith Gerard Miller was offering for this conversion service. Though for this project, being that it's more of a one-way-trip for the frames, I'd shop by gunsmith for best results, not price. Kinda like shopping for lasik eye surgery, I'm not enticed by the surgical shine one eye and you get the next one free kinda deal.
    The guys at TPM worked for Murray for years, so they are Master HK gunsmiths.

  10. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by scottinthegrove View Post
    So you feel that in "the current market" a registered trigger frame will sell for the same as a sear?
    Sometimes the price disparity is more obvious. For example, this member is eager to trade his Fleming sear in an ambi 4-pos w/ 3-rnd burst pack + host gun (MP5K-N PDW) for a transferable trigger frame: https://www.hkpro.com/forum/wanted-bu...igger-box.html

    Its safe to assume that he would settle with an SEF configuration and would probably even accept a frame only without a trigger pack or trigger housing.

  11. #60
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    Neo, did Tim use factory HK boxes for his registered trigger boxes?

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