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For those inquiring (i.e., HK911, FMP XG3S, etc.), the effective date for the ban was MARCH 14, 1989.
 

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I believe it was a 1989 ruling by the ATF after an Executive Order. It is not a law.

Any of those firearms can be modified, based on state and local laws, once they contain the proper number of U.S. components.

JPG
 

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So, An FMP XG3 3-89 sold originally in 1989 with the pistol grip and standard stock is legal as is? Or not? And is it correct to assume that if it is legal or pre-ban or whatever terminology "de jour" applies, with the standard configuration that it was sold originally with i.e. pistol grip, standard buttstock, no other foreign parts may be put on this gun without 922r compliance? If the last question is a fact then this is beyond asinine because if the gun is acceptable in the "as sold "configuration i.e. pistol grip, standard buttstock, threaded barrel/w flashider, that in fact and per implication makes this a pre non-domestic/pre non-sporting configuration article ERGO, 922r is irrevelant. However, with the application of a foreign part other than what was originally on the weapon the previously 922r compliant article is now in violation??!!! I could potentially accept this rational on a 5-89,G3 but a 3-89 is just that, 3-89. Nothing is marked per deim, totally ludicris!!
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Correct on the Bush Executive Order and from whence it was derived.

Sorry for any confusion on the status of the item, just wanted to give the date for those who had previously inquired.

Praetorian- your XG3S ("3/89") would have been imported with those "pre-89" features (i.e., legal), just marked "X" when held in Customs to designate "not yet released to public on EO effective date"; however, any modification(s) would (better to err on side of caution) need to comply with 922.
 

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Other than one or two adament people who claim the contrary:
G3S pre-ban configuration
XG3S post-ban configuration.

I know the ATF rulings are preposterous. If you own the firearm in a form that was not importable at the time of import, then it is "illegal". It doesn't have to make sense, this is the government we are talking about.

The consensus is that the ATF wouldn't come looking for you, but if they ever charged you with anything, this charge would be stacked on for good measure.

What I always say is "If it sounds illegal, it probably IS illegal" I didn't even bother. I purchased U.S. compliance parts and I got a letter from the ATF stating the legality of my adding PSG-1 accessories to my post-ban imported XG3S.

My never updated webpage:
http://home.att.net/~j.p.george/

JPG
 

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My xg3s is also with normal stock and pistol grip. I am to the point of selling it because i can't tell what is US made and what is not. I just got it from a dealer as it is. stock is numbered to the gun so I have to think it is original. I think I am going to put a bid on a HK 91 and try and buy one and sell this xg3s.
 

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For those inquiring (i.e., HK911, FMP XG3S, etc.), the effective date for the ban was MARCH 14, 1989.
This was the date an executive order was implemented. After much research of reading the law prima facia the consensus is that until this EO was signed into law in 1990 all weapons in country could be released as is for public consumption. That is why people are in possession of these and were allowed to buy them in public. Also, if you were in possession of said article the end consumer could personally apply parts to it to return it to original configuration that is why initially Springfield Armory sold SARs with a revision kit. Prior to this importers and dealers reconverted them. It was only after ATF asked them to stop that they did. At this time ALL still had threaded muzzles/pistol grips, etc and after 1990 these could easily be reconfigured because they had already been imported. In late 1990 I purchased a Springfield SAR 4800 (SAR 4800 being post 922 receiver stamping) in just such configuration, the threaded muzzle had a thread protector that screwed on and off, no permanent alterations as seen in ALL IMPORTED weapons post facto,i.e. MAK90s and others. Why was this allowed to be sold in this configuration? All weapons in country were "grandfathered" in because until this became law it was NOT A LAW and at this time there was no 10 foreign parts or less rule. This had to be devised for clarity purposes anything pre-10 parts rule was "grandfathered". Furthermore the current law states that weapons previous to the implimentation of said law are exempt under the subsection where it says that these can be repaired or original parts applied to these particular cases because they were already here. Lastly, the law 922r unlike 922v (AWB), states it is unlawful to MANUFACTURE (importer) a non-sporting type weapon, not to be in possession of one and the statute of limitations on that where a manufacture knowingly superceded 922r and could be prosecuted is five years. "Manufacture" is relavent after this became law. This is legalese and laws are about wording not what you read into it. This is why there is STILL no legal description of what a sporting type weapon is. Many just adhere to the 10 rule part to avoid confusion however legally before this was law is subject to debate in favor of the previous explanation.
 

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legalese

This was the date an executive order was implemented. After much research of reading the law prima facia the consensus is that until this EO was signed into law in 1990 all weapons in country could be released as is for public consumption. That is why people are in possession of these and were allowed to buy them in public. Also, if you were in possession of said article the end consumer could personally apply parts to it to return it to original configuration that is why initially Springfield Armory sold SARs with a revision kit. Prior to this importers and dealers reconverted them. It was only after ATF asked them to stop that they did. At this time ALL still had threaded muzzles/pistol grips, etc and after 1990 these could easily be reconfigured because they had already been imported. In late 1990 I purchased a Springfield SAR 4800 (SAR 4800 being post 922 receiver stamping) in just such configuration, the threaded muzzle had a thread protector that screwed on and off, no permanent alterations as seen in ALL IMPORTED weapons post facto,i.e. MAK90s and others. Why was this allowed to be sold in this configuration? All weapons in country were "grandfathered" in because until this became law it was NOT A LAW and at this time there was no 10 foreign parts or less rule. This had to be devised for clarity purposes anything pre-10 parts rule was "grandfathered". Furthermore the current law states that weapons previous to the implimentation of said law are exempt under the subsection where it says that these can be repaired or original parts applied to these particular cases because they were already here. Lastly, the law 922r unlike 922v (AWB), states it is unlawful to MANUFACTURE (importer) a non-sporting type weapon, not to be in possession of one and the statute of limitations on that where a manufacture knowingly superceded 922r and could be prosecuted is five years. "Manufacture" is relavent after this became law. This is legalese and laws are about wording not what you read into it. This is why there is STILL no legal description of what a sporting type weapon is. Many just adhere to the 10 rule part to avoid confusion however legally before this was law is subject to debate in favor of the previous explanation.
so if I added the 91 parts to my 911 in 1991 the five years is obviously over so no problem? bob
 

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Springfield Armory sold "accurizing kits" for the SAR-48 and SAR-8 series that included the pistol grip, buttstock, and flash suppressor.

Mitchell Arms sent pistol grips and buttstocks out in the boxes of the newly modded M90's.
 

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so if I added the 91 parts to my 911 in 1991 the five years is obviously over so no problem? bob
Yes, the statute of limitations has expired. However, you are entering into some very vague legal issues. If YOU put these parts on in 1991, you are in violation because after Nov.1990 it became a law, ergo any changes after this time = illegal manufacture of a non-sporting ,non-importable weapon. It could have been done so pre Nov.1990. This is difficult to prove however as to when conversion occured. Futhermore, if you bought the gun in the reconfigured state after Nov.1990 it is assumed it was configured pre Nov.1990 and the illegality if any is on the part of the reconfigurer. Remember it was only illegal to MANUFACTURER not POSSESS an illegal weapon. It may still be subject to confiscation. The bottom line is this: if you own one of these, and these are excellent rifles, it is easiest to make it 922r compliant. I wanted a wide forearm on my XG3 not the slim line tropical one it came with and I wanted the furniture black not green so, even though it had been reconfigured pre Nov.1990, it came with a PG and regular buttstock, I had changed the ORIGINAL configurated, importable version, thus 922r applies and I had to get US parts and now it would be illegal to put the green furniture back on the rifle now since reconfiguration is ex-post facto. Furthermore, this reconfiguration could not be done until the expiration of the AWB 922v {clinton}because it then could not possess a threaded muzzle or more than two offending cosmetic features. Ridiculous no? This will probably change AGAIN when the commies take office. Either more hoops to jump through or confiscation.
 

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922r

Yes, the statute of limitations has expired. However, you are entering into some very vague legal issues. If YOU put these parts on in 1991, you are in violation because after Nov.1990 it became a law, ergo any changes after this time = illegal manufacture of a non-sporting ,non-importable weapon. It could have been done so pre Nov.1990. This is difficult to prove however as to when conversion occurred. Furthermore, if you bought the gun in the reconfigured state after Nov.1990 it is assumed it was configured pre Nov.1990 and the illegality if any is on the part of the reconfigurer. Remember it was only illegal to MANUFACTURER not POSSESS an illegal weapon. It may still be subject to confiscation. The bottom line is this: if you own one of these, and these are excellent rifles, it is easiest to make it 922r compliant. I wanted a wide forearm on my XG3 not the slim line tropical one it came with and I wanted the furniture black not green so, even though it had been reconfigured pre Nov.1990, it came with a PG and regular buttstock, I had changed the ORIGINAL configurated, importable version, thus 922r applies and I had to get US parts and now it would be illegal to put the green furniture back on the rifle now since reconfiguration is ex-post facto. Furthermore, this reconfiguration could not be done until the expiration of the AWB 922v {clinton}because it then could not possess a threaded muzzle or more than two offending cosmetic features. Ridiculous no? This will probably change AGAIN when the commies take office. Either more hoops to jump through or confiscation.
yes I have the receipts but maybe the parts count thing will work over time to pick up the pieces. probably no one will care especially as it is legally registered in Kalifornia. stocks, magazines, forends no problem but what other parts can lessen the parts count? does the trigger assembly contain enough parts to reduce the count to 10? the possession thing is interesting. not manufacture? love to play the game by the rules and win if I can. I have also changed the flash hider out to another non flash hider barrel tuner. sorry for taking up every ones valuable time but we all learn together. god help us in the future depending on what the supreme court says(maybe). bob
 

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People are saying they have 1989 firearms that have the "evil" features. Well, there is wiggle room. If we discuss a post-89 import, it must meet the rules as of it's importation date. UNLESS you buy and install enough U.S. parts, then you are golden.

As I am in NY state, I am still living in the 1994. I am REALLY considering getting some camping/hiking/shooting land in PA. I could store any "illegal" parts in that state. I can be in PA in about an hour. I can live with that. My weekly range visit is ~20min from my house as it is.

JPG
 

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There is 17 parts with a flashhider. Do not worry how may US parts you can have ,worry that you can only have 10 non-US parts. In this instance that equals 7 US parts. 1. IGF flashider
2. JLD trigger
3. JLD sear
4. JLD hammer
5. JLD FCG box
6. BMP cocking lever
7. JLD buttstock 8. BMP pistol grip lower
So then, 8-17= 9 non US parts. This includes Kraut mags.You only need 7. Good to go.
 

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What if you bought the gun as is from an FFL this year, I did nothing to it. it had a muzzle break, pistol grip and everything else
 

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What if you bought the gun as is from an FFL this year, I did nothing to it. it had a muzzle break, pistol grip and everything else
Have been there already, Your gun is an FMP-XG3, right? That means it was in country before Nov.1990 so it was probably converted before then. If it remains in ORIGINAL imported configuration,i.e. tropical forearm, green furniture, threaded muzzle break with flashhider and pistol grip then it falls into the catagory of being grandfathered into legal status. There is no way to determine when it was configured. It most probably came into the country the way you got it. Mine did. Furthermore, the law states "any weapon imported before Nov.1990 is exempt and replacement parts CAN be applied to the weapon without being in non-compliance. I changed the furniture to black and therefore altered the original configuration thusly 922r applies and it legally cannot be reconverted to its original imported state.
 
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