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And so it begins: 9mm USC to 16" UMP Conversion and links to ALL UMP Conversion Info!

85475 Views 117 Replies 37 Participants Last post by  Gokoolab
And so it begins: 9mm USC to 16" UMP Conversion and links to ALL UMP Conversion Info!

Well I *think* I’m the first person to undertake this particular conversion although I believe others have already done the 9mm UMP conversion with the 8” Barrel (feel free to chime in here guys! :)).

My main purpose here is to actually create a place with ALL the links and other information needed to complete a DIY USC to UMP conversion of any caliber.

First let me say this article is in NO way to say that you should not use any of the vendors that offer this conversion, rather than simply a place to find links and other pertinent info for those of us who really enjoy cutting up a brand new gun :D

Links to Machining Information for Conversion:
A VERY Basic Guide, read this first to get an idea of what needs to be done:
http://tradecraft.us/Firearms/HowToUMP/HowToUMP.htm

A VERY DETAILED Guide, read this when you have your parts and are ready for specs!
http://home.comcast.net/~UMPlower/

UMP Foregrip Vent Location:
http://myweb.cableone.net/jsheffi31/Slots.htm

UMP Mag Well Template
http://hkpro.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=1743&stc=1&d=1188954110

UMP/USC Parts Comparisons (See Gallery)
www.tacticalexcellence.com

NFA Information that may be helpful when doing conversions:
http://www.top-notchparts.com/atf_nfa_letters.htm

Links to Suppliers for Conversion Parts (The ones I personally used)
Adam Webber HK4Evr www.hkparts.net
Ed HDPS www.hdps.org
Top Notch Parts www.top-notchparts.com
Other Suppliers of Note:
Gordon Miller - www.hkspecialist.net
Phil Flack - [email protected]
Clyde Armory - www.policeguns.com

Now that I’ve got the basics out of the way I’m going to document what’s needed to do this conversion AND change calibers. I couldn’t find a lot of the information I needed easily such as how much I needed to change the bolt, 16” barrel suppliers ect. Let me start off by saying that while the regular 45ACP UMP conversion is actually very reasonable if you buy parts from the suppliers listed above, changing calibers can be VERY EXPENSIVE; you have been warned :D

Caliber Specific Conversion Parts:
Bolt Assembly
Barrell
Magazines

I bought all of the above parts (and parts for all my other guns) from Adam Webber (www.hkparts.net) and I can’t say enough about him and his service; amazing! Now before you go and call/email/homing pigeon ect Adam, he doesn’t have any more 9mm parts but does have plenty of 45 and I believe even some 40 parts. I will warn you that in my experience the 9mm parts may as well be made from un-obtainium as I had a HELL of a time finding ANYTHING in 9mm.

By now you are asking "Why the hell would he want 9mm?" Well the answer is relatively simple; I like 9mm :) All of my other guns (with the exception of the AR) are 9mm.

I was able to find ONE supplier that made a handful of 16” .40/9mm barrels and that was Top Notch. According to the gentleman I spoke to when I ordered he believed I was the first to buy one of the 16” units but still had a few left. I also bought an 8” HK barrel from Adam on the odd chance that someday Michigan will allow SBR (HA!).

The Parts:
HK 8” UMP 9mm Barrel, 9mm Magazine, 9mm Bolt Group (.45/.40/9mm all use the same recoil rod BTW) and some extra barrel pins.



Now that I’ve got these parts I’ll start to document what you need to do to the bolt to assemble this thing as well as updating this when my 16” Barrel arrives and how the gunfunctions/looks ect. I hope this post will help some people not have to search for hours to find information like I did!
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Oh ok. Thanks for the response. That makes alot of sense. I just wanted to make sure i wasnt getting ripped off. Now that you've explained it, it is a good idea. Not only does it keep the guy doing the conversion from being liable, but if ATF ever came to check and I was to show them the block, it should keep me out of trouble. Im still waiting on my USC though. Im starting to get impatient. lol
 

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Discussion Starter · #45 ·
Sweet! Looks like you snagged one of Adams bolts and some mags eh? I just got my 5 other mags in today (thanks Adam) now if I could only get my [email protected]#%#% Barrel, yes its been what 7 months now? I cant even get a straight answer out of anyone I was supposed to have it this time LAST week but of course Top Notch doesnt have any real business hours.
 

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Yes, I got the bolt from Adam. It was like finding the Holy Grail :) As for the barrel, I've been sitting on it for almost 2 years. Which is a lucky thing I had since the TN 9mm barrels appear to be defective. I went out to the Top Notch site earlier this evening and the only barrels I see offered are 45 ACP. I did not see any references to 40 or 9mm.

Have you tried posting on TB's board? He usually answers posts from folks with problems, maybe he can get this back in front of Wade. I'd like to see them fix these barrels, because I was thinking about buying one and having it cut down and 3-lugged for my Gemtech Raptor.

In any case, I hope you get the issue resolved. Meantime, have you tried your factory barrel? Does the conversion work OK with it?

Thanks
James
 

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Discussion Starter · #47 ·
Yes, I got the bolt from Adam. It was like finding the Holy Grail :) As for the barrel, I've been sitting on it for almost 2 years. Which is a lucky thing I had since the TN 9mm barrels appear to be defective. I went out to the Top Notch site earlier this evening and the only barrels I see offered are 45 ACP. I did not see any references to 40 or 9mm.

Have you tried posting on TB's board? He usually answers posts from folks with problems, maybe he can get this back in front of Wade. I'd like to see them fix these barrels, because I was thinking about buying one and having it cut down and 3-lugged for my Gemtech Raptor.

In any case, I hope you get the issue resolved. Meantime, have you tried your factory barrel? Does the conversion work OK with it?

Thanks
James
I cant try my factory barrel we are in a non SBR state :( Otherwise I'd be all set lol, I dont know what to do about this thing its driving me nuts i've tried to be patient but man I'm SERIOUSLY running out of it. That and you cant even leave a voicemail for TN REALLY irks me..
 

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I got through to TN today and ordered one of the 16" 9mm barrels. GTPprix, give them a call tomorrow or Wednesday. From what Todd said on his board, and what the lady at TN said today, they are getting a new batch of the barrels late this week. Maybe one of the new barrels will fix your issue. Start calling them tomorrow and see if you can find out what's up. Meanwhile, I'll let you know once mine comes in and I have a chance to test it.

Thanks,
James
 

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Discussion Starter · #49 ·
I got through to TN today and ordered one of the 16" 9mm barrels. GTPprix, give them a call tomorrow or Wednesday. From what Todd said on his board, and what the lady at TN said today, they are getting a new batch of the barrels late this week. Maybe one of the new barrels will fix your issue. Start calling them tomorrow and see if you can find out what's up. Meanwhile, I'll let you know once mine comes in and I have a chance to test it.

Thanks,
James
Thats what I've been hearing for weeks :(
 

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Discussion Starter · #53 ·
Well maybe I spoke too soon, Wade insisted that I shoot it and it would work. To my amazement it did and he was absolutely right! I'm VERY happy with this now, the only thing I may do is champfer the entry to the chamber to help with one minor issue I had. I shot 100 rounds out of it today and it worked 98% of the time. I believe a champfer will fix the 2% issue. I'm extatic!
 

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Got my TN 9mm barrel Thursday. It has some light finish wear, and had unburnt powder flecks in the barrel. I assume that was from test-firing, unless I was sent GTPPrix's old one :)

I took it out on my lunch break yesterday, installed on my TE conversion. I ran some Georgia Arms 147-grain and Winchester White Box 115-grain through it. Here are the results:

Mag 1: 27 rounds GA - no malfunctions
Mag 2: 31 rounds WWB - 2 failure-to-feed
Mag 3: 30 rounds WWB - 2 failure-to-feed
Mag 4: 30 rounds WWB - 1 failure-to-feed
Mag 5: 10 rounds WWB - no malfunctions

The 5 FTFs were all the same type. Apparently the lip of the casing was catching on the "ramp" on the top of the barrel. The round would stick in that position, bolt partially open. I think a polishing job on the ramp might be in order. Jams were different positions in the mag, no "last round only" or other detectable pattern.

I am going to send it to Mark at TROS for a chop and 3-lug job. I assume he can do the polish job as well. I'll report back when I get it back from him and do another test.

Thanks,
James
 

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Discussion Starter · #55 ·
Got my TN 9mm barrel Thursday. It has some light finish wear, and had unburnt powder flecks in the barrel. I assume that was from test-firing, unless I was sent GTPPrix's old one :)

I took it out on my lunch break yesterday, installed on my TE conversion. I ran some Georgia Arms 147-grain and Winchester White Box 115-grain through it. Here are the results:

Mag 1: 27 rounds GA - no malfunctions
Mag 2: 31 rounds WWB - 2 failure-to-feed
Mag 3: 30 rounds WWB - 2 failure-to-feed
Mag 4: 30 rounds WWB - 1 failure-to-feed
Mag 5: 10 rounds WWB - no malfunctions

The 5 FTFs were all the same type. Apparently the lip of the casing was catching on the "ramp" on the top of the barrel. The round would stick in that position, bolt partially open. I think a polishing job on the ramp might be in order. Jams were different positions in the mag, no "last round only" or other detectable pattern.

I am going to send it to Mark at TROS for a chop and 3-lug job. I assume he can do the polish job as well. I'll report back when I get it back from him and do another test.

Thanks,
James

I did 100 rounds of Fiocchi 115GR and had two of the EXACT same FTF's. I'm 99% sure the barrel needs a champfer on the entrace to the chamber as the HK's have this but ours do not. Its that sharp edge that catches the casing. After all this time I'll fix that no problem!
 

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I did 100 rounds of Fiocchi 115GR and had two of the EXACT same FTF's. I'm 99% sure the barrel needs a champfer on the entrace to the chamber as the HK's have this but ours do not. Its that sharp edge that catches the casing. After all this time I'll fix that no problem!


Several of our department guns had a problem with ramp feeding problems. These were Smith and Wesson handguns, but our armor used the Simichrome polish with a cloth dremel tool and it polished the ramp and it quickly ended our ramp feeding problems, he actually recommends using it once a year to ensure maximum reliability on the feed ramp.

http://www.123tack.com/winning/prod...SH&productid=PAAAAALNGJJGKGOB&channelid=FROOG
I dont know if you can buy it from this page but just the first page i found on google.
 

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Mark has my TN 9mm barrel in hand. He is going to polish the ramp for me. He said that it is thick enough to do an integral 3-lug, so we'll see what happens. I'll report back when he gets it done.
 

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