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Any News on HK’s Micro Carry?

4866 Views 46 Replies 17 Participants Last post by  Pew_Pew
Any news and rumors on HK’s micro carry? That they were supposedly working on

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last thread was more than a year ago and it gotturned into a boomer vs millennial (hammer vs striker fired) thread and got closed
 

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Short version: It wasn't up to HK's standards and the reveal/release was pushed back indefinitely. As far as we know, HK has not dropped the project and it is still being tested/refined. Keep in mind, HK never did a public reveal and no release date has been announced.



 

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I personally am not excited. It's not going to be more popular vs the P365 and the Shield. Plus it's not going to offer anything new other than have an "HK" etched on the slide. No paddle lever, the same Glock, Hellcat, and Shield Plus trigger, striker-fired, etc. Nothing to get excited over. Plus, it's not like the are going to beat the competition cost wise on the price of the gun and mags. If they scrapped it, it was a smart move.
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I personally am not excited. It's not going to be more popular vs the P365 and the Shield. Plus it's not going to offer anything new other than have an "HK" etched on the slide. No paddle lever, the same Glock, Hellcat, and Shield Plus trigger, striker-fired, etc. Nothing to get excited over. Plus, it's not like the are going to beat the competition cost wise on the price of the gun and mags. If they scrapped it, it was a smart move.
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Based on some conversations with some peers, I’m under the impression that these micros are mostly floating on whatever reputation the buyer is willing to extend to the company in general…which is risky.

I don’t believe most of these guns are vetted to the level that many assume.


I would hope HK can give more in that respect.
I wish them all the best in building a better mousetrap for an impossible to please customer base.
 

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Based on some conversations with some peers, I’m under the impression that these micros are mostly floating on whatever reputation the buyer is willing to extend to the company in general…which is risky.

I don’t believe most of these guns are vetted to the level that many assume.


I would hope HK can give more in that respect.
I wish them all the best in building a better mousetrap for an impossible to please customer base.
I don't trust any company to not have missed something and to have accounted for every possible possibility (including HK). The only vetting I trust is when a particular design has been massed produced and used by a large demographic of people over the course of years without any consistent QC issues, premature problems, or safety issues.

The P365 and Hellcat have been in wide spread usage for approximately 5 years with millions sold, and the M&P Shield design has been around for over a decade. Anywhere between 4 to 5 million Shields have sold. I believe they all have been vetted as well as any at this point.
 

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I don't trust any company to not have missed something and to have accounted for every possible possibility (including HK). The only vetting I trust is when a particular design has been massed produced and used by a large demographic of people over the course of years without any consistent QC issues, premature problems, or safety issues.

The P365 and Hellcat have been in wide spread usage for approximately 5 years with millions sold, and the M&P Shield design has been around for over a decade. Anywhere between 4 to 5 million Shields have sold. I believe they all have been vetted as well as any at this point.

To each their own...
But here's my counterpoint to that "logic" of vetting quality by sales numbers.

I don't know anyone that would say this is a quality product in its class, but 100+ BILLION have been sold and consumed over 80 years...

 

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To each their own...
But here's my counterpoint to that "logic" of vetting quality by sales numbers.

I don't know anyone that would say this is a quality product in its class, but 100+ BILLION have been sold and consumed over 80 years...

It's a cute retort, but highly illogical. One is a sandwich that is consumed and the other is a tool that can be carried and used repeatedly for decades. I shouldn't have to explain the difference, and how that's an apples to hammer comparison.

The fact that a tool, e.g., Glocks 19, M&P, Sig P226, CZ 75, and even the HKs USP, has been in widespread use with millions of units sold in the military, with law enforcement, and in the private sector for years of service and has still held up and past the test of time on that large of a scale is proves that the design and platform is sound. That's major vetting, and more than any one manufacturer cound do on their own. Most would concede that those tools have been highly vetted. I'd bet you normally would too, but not in this case being it does suit your narrative.

I don't care if HK or any other manufacture claims that they vetted the crap out if a newly engineered pistol. I still won't be an initial beta tester on a new product. I still wouldn't assume or consider any new to market tool as being more vetted vs a tool that has been in use with millions of consumers, under different conditions, and using a bunch of different factory and hand loaded ammo, etc for a series of years and still has a widespread reputation of being safe and reliable.

The overwhelming number of civilian and experts alike who know anything about firearms would consider the P365, Hellcat, Glock 43/48 and, most of all, the M&P Shield highly vetted, reliable, and trustworthy platforms.
 

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but not in this case being it does suit your narrative.
Not sure what you think my narrative is. At most it's: don't be a sheep and rely on the masses to make your personal decisions.
True, some bets are safer than others but not every company makes their "contract" stuff the same as their commercial stuff. And even that can change over time...I can crack some Colt books or wade into the Beretta 92/M9 and we can run though that one together on what "milspec" means.

Glock is going to do what Glock does (market hard, beta test commercially and quietly upgrade models)
Sig is going to do what Sig/Cohen does (out think Glock, produce in bulk cheaply, beta test commercially and issue recalls)
HK is going to do what HK does (not going to cast assumptions on what I believe they do in this crowd)
S&W and SA are going to do whatever it is they do...

...so on and so forth.

All I can say is, you don't have to follow the herd or forge your own path...just understand why you're going the way you are.

I've spent long enough figuring out who I am and what "tools" I need, I've got no time to tell you any different. Just trying to make others who come across this pause and think for a moment...maybe, just maybe make a slightly smarter decision.
 

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Not sure what you think my narrative is. At most it's: don't be a sheep and rely on the masses to make your personal decisions.
True, some bets are safer than others but not every company makes their "contract" stuff the same as their commercial stuff. And even that can change over time...I can crack some Colt books or wade into the Beretta 92/M9 and we can run though that one together on what "milspec" means.

Glock is going to do what Glock does (market hard, beta test commercially and quietly upgrade models)
Sig is going to do what Sig/Cohen does (out think Glock, produce in bulk cheaply, beta test commercially and issue recalls)
HK is going to do what HK does (not going to cast assumptions on what I believe they do in this crowd)
S&W and SA are going to do whatever it is they do...

...so on and so forth.

All I can say is, you don't have to follow the herd or forge your own path...just understand why you're going the way you are.

I've spent long enough figuring out who I am and what "tools" I need, I've got no time to tell you any different. Just trying to make others who come across this pause and think for a moment...maybe, just maybe make a slightly smarter decision.
Has nothing to do with following or being steeple. That's an entirely different topic. I am following the data and track record. The reported pros, cons, and other issues that may exist. If a platform is widely used by millions of people with differ skill levels, under a pothera of different conditions, and using an array of different ammo, stands up to the test of time and usage, that is all real world data that most, including you, usually take into account.

I can almost guarantee you took that into account before you decided to purchase your first HK. I bet most of what you know good and bad about any HK platform you purchased came from others who already owned one, and you took their experiences and the reputation of the platform as a whole into account. That doesn't make you a follower; that makes you an intelligent well informed consumer. It's why feedback exist on Amazon products and even with buyers and sellers on Amazon, Ebay, and GunBroker. Someone with a large number of sales or a product that has sold millions and still has a great track record is generally an indication that the product or seller can be trusted... Heck, your bank and credit card lenders even look to others to vet you before lending you money based on how you handled credit over time.

I take that data and track record into consideration, amongst other things, before making a purchase, and if and when I do decide to make a purchase, I put rounds down range to verify my example is also reliable.
 

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I don't know about exact data, but SIG's track record the last decade has been quite lousy if one has been paying attention. The 320 alone, which is now "getting there" as a solid platform, took a few years of revisions and recalls. The largest of those arguably should have never been necessary for a properly-tested pistol and it still wasn't even acknowledged until SIG got backed into a corner over the issue.

And before someone comes in to tell me how I am an HK fanboy, I currently have 5 SIGs.

But this isn't about SIG vs HK, both have their fans and detractors. That being said, if HK released a micro pistol, I doubt it will need the same level of revision that some others have needed.
 

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I don't know about exact data, but SIG's track record the last decade has been quite lousy if one has been paying attention. The 320 is getting there as a solid platform but it certainly took a few years of revisions and recalls, the largest of which arguably should have never been necessary for a properly-tested pistol and which still wasn't even done until SIG got backed into a corner over the issue.

And before someone comes in to tell me how I am an HK fanboy, I currently have 5 SIGs.
True, and it took being vetted by many others before each and every short coming was found and pointed out. The P320 was on the market for a couple of years, but wasn't very popular. It took them winning a contract, and being in widespread usage before we all knew about the problems with the P320. I don't own one and I am not interested in owning one because of the confirmed issues and the allegations from dozens of unaffiliated owners. I was just on SigTalk a month or so ago calling out the problems with the P320 in a huge thread about it.

With the P365, Hellcat, and the M&P Shield, I feel that it's been around long enough, has been highly scrutinized, and used by millions. The P365, Hellcat, and Shield has also had separate L.E. testing done by some department and police organizations. People who forgotten more about firearms than we know use and vouch for them. I feel like they have been highly vetted. More so than any manufacturer could do on their own.

Unless God himself engineers and manufacturers the perfect handgun, I am not going to assume it's good to go just because of who manufactured it. Manufacturers are human and can not think of every single possibility, situation, or issue a firearm might encounter. Those bugs are typically uncovered out in the wild. I will trust an M&P that went through it's teething stage, had a different upgrades over the years, and now has a solid product with all the kinks worked out vs a newly engineered from the ground up pistol from Glock, HK, or whoever.
 

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People who forgotten more about firearms than we know use and vouch for them.
I understand your point but you may be surprised at the level of firearms training, knowledge, and experience that many folks on this forum have. Also, some of those models you have named have had multiple product revisions due to reliability concerns, which is what dms16 was likely referring to. I tried two of those guns you mentioned and was not impressed; it is likely that the HK Micro will end with the same result.

SO, take my opinions on the micro-compact topic with a huge grain of salt!
 

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I understand your point but you may be surprised at the level of firearms training, knowledge, and experience that many folks on this forum have. Also, some of those models you have named have had multiple product revisions due to reliability concerns, which is what dms16 was likely referring to.
Yes, I agree that their are members on this forum with firearms training, knowledge, and experience. Many of those same type of people also EDC, personally vetted, and put thousands of rounds through M&P Shields, P365s, etc. Am I wrong for taking their and millions of others long and short term experiences into account? Does that make me a follower? Does that data and long history of stability account for nothing?

Yes, and that's my point. All the bugs have been uncovered and out. All the teething issues found and fixed. They have been vetted and have proven to be reliable in the hands of millions over the course of years. I trust the final iteration of current Glocks, M&Ps, etc over something brand new fresh off the press.

Let me ask you this @RetropM. If HK released a brand new DA/SA pistol built from the ground up tomorrow, would you trust it more than the USP?
 

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It's a saturated market, but if it's at least on par with the 365, it'll sell well to those brand loyal to HK, or to police departments that are already using a full size HK 9mm, and this could serve as backup. But if we're just talking about a pistol that's still too big to compete with the 365, and doesn't carry as many rounds-forget about it. Seriously, if it's just slightly smaller and lighter than that yawnfest VP9 subcompact, it should never see the light of day
 

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It's a saturated market, but if it's at least on par with the 365, it'll sell well to those brand loyal to HK, or to police departments that are already using a full size HK 9mm, and this could serve as backup. But if we're just talking about a pistol that's still too big to compete with the 365, and doesn't carry as many rounds-forget about it. Seriously, if it's just slightly smaller and lighter than that yawnfest VP9 subcompact, it should never see the light of day
I agree that it will appeal to HK fanboys (which I kind of am), but the one thing that the P365 has going for it is the Glock level aftermarket support, Baskin-Robbins 31 flavors you can get it in, and all that comes with being a modular platform. As I seen on this forum, even many HK fanboys are invested and will argue to the death over the P365.

I went with the Hellcat and Shield Plus already, and I am not sure a HK variant will offer enough to make me want to cut my losses. If they would have released a 10+1 micro 9mm around the same time the Hellcat and Shield were released, I am sure I would have went with the HK version. They are late to the party, they aren't going to offer more features or be priced competitively, and many people are already well in vested in the platforms that were available.

I hope they come out with something that is different and separates them from the pack like a DA/SA 10+1 micro 9mm preferably with a lever mag release.

I could be completely wrong, and it won't be the first. That's just one mans worthless opinion.
 

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Based on some conversations with some peers, I’m under the impression that these micros are mostly floating on whatever reputation the buyer is willing to extend to the company in general…which is risky.

I don’t believe most of these guns are vetted to the level that many assume.
Have you been able to confirm those tests results we chatted about?
 
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