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Discussion Starter #1
I've had 100 pretty troublesome rounds down the tube thus far. Mostly FTE's every other round. I ordered a new RCM bolt group and German ejector and they came in today. I did some roller swapping and checked bolt gap then emptied an entire magazine without a single failure of any kind! woohoo!

Here's the issue. With the original TB/Bellator MIM bolt group, bolt gap was right around .020 with the -6 rollers the gun came with. When I dropped the RCM bolt group in with its standard rollers, bolt gap was off the chart. My feeler gauge set only goes to .035 and it was bigger than that. I put the -6 rollers into the RCM bolt which helped a little, but not nearly enough. Next, i put the original ba89 locking piece in with the RCM bolt and carrier. With the -6 rollers it gaps at .024 which is what i shot it at when there were no malfunctions. the ba89 locking piece says #16 on it which should be 110 deg. The RCM says 110 so they should be comparable but there must be some serious wear on the Bellator one. That or it's been ground down.

I obviously have a headspace problem. The question is how much of a problem this is.

If it's a serious problem, then i can think of several options to fix it:

- Go with -8 rollers. It's like I always hear around here, though: rollers are only a patch, not a fix
- Research whether another locking piece like a 100 or 90 degree would shrink up the gap and still work reliably
- Send the gun back to Bellator and have them re-press/pin the barrel under warranty
- Buy a Navy or three lug barrel and send it off to Ghilliebear or someone to have it pressed in (anyone know how much this would cost and the time it would take?

What would you do?
 

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Dont they have a lifetime warranty?

I'd return it to stock and try that route first.

No use throwing dollars at it when the manufacturer will probably just make it right
 

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Dont they have a lifetime warranty?

I'd return it to stock and try that route first.

No use throwing dollars at it when the manufacturer will probably just make it right
Or try at least, right? This is the second thread I can think of about these things sucking.
 

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If it runs now, I would just shoot it and stop worrying about it. Even with the big bolt gap, you appear to still be getting good primer strikes.
 

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Spending $500 (RCM bolt group) on a $1000 gun seems a little out of balance.

I would contact Atlantic first, they are good people. If that fails, I would contact Todd / Bellator and request warranty work.

Of course, remove all non-Bellator parts.

And remember, Todd reads this board regularly. Just an FYI.

YMMV.
 

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If the gun is in spec with the stock parts, then you will be told RCM is the problem and you will be directed to a YouTube video showing such... I'd send it back in the FTE's...

Like its been said, if it shoots and the primers strikes are strong, got shoot it! The barrel may settle in or a variety of other break in items to help it smooth out.

So... Just shoot it and keep an eye on any roller marked in the rails.
 

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And remember, Todd reads this board regularly. Just an FYI.
A big +1 on this. He'll be extremely PO'ed that you shared your experience here. Then he'll try to blame RCM or Ghillie or Chopstick or Obama or .....

Here's how my customer experience went with Todd - I bought one of those "Finished" Upper Vector MP5/40 kits and he asked that I post this here on HK pro several times

Subject: Re: Question regarding GunBroker.com Item

Hi, I bought one of these kits a while back. I also own another v5-40 rifle. On the welded kit none of my mags will lock into the mag well and when the mags are inserted the bolt won't close. I've used both types of US mags (greyish and shiny black)and also 5 different HK factory mags. Can I get this fixed or replaced? Thanks

From: <[email protected]>
To: rpm3000
Sent: Friday, December 16, 2011 12:40 PM
Subject: Re: Question regarding GunBroker.com Item

it is sold as a kit it might take final adjustment to get every thing fitting correct these are kits we got back from vectors we do not warranty them as is I suggest getting with Hk gunsmith
From: rpm3000
To: <[email protected]>
Cc: specialwp <[email protected]>
Sent: Sun, Dec 18, 2011 11:25 am
Subject: Re: Question regarding GunBroker.com Item

I had no problem with any final adjustments when I bought this. I was fine with replacing the bolt head and fitting all of the other parts, but the problem I have is the welded placement of the semi shelf and mag release paddle. The receiver is going to need to be cut apart, semi shelf removed, mag paddle parts will need to be fixed or replaced and then it'll all need to be welded and finished again. I'm not even certain if that'll fix it all, because it also appears that the trunnion isn't timed correctly.

I really didn't expect to spend more money completing this finished kit vs the last completely unfinished v5-40 kit I bought from you. And if I understand what you've told me, I believe your add should state that these are partially completed guns rejected by Vector.

Todd Bailey SW inc <[email protected]> wrote:

the guns were vectors when they got in to trouble with the feds we took them back 1/2 done and tried to fix and sell them off go post that on Hkpro PS we have sold 750 of these you are the only one with these issues so my guess is you do not know what you are doing!!!!

On Dec 18, 2011, at 6:08 PM, "rpm3000 "wrote:
Your welded upper + your US mag or HK = no lock . Looks like the catch is .1875" too high. Seems like something a top notch organization like yours should have caught before it was listed for sale...


You tell me now that you tried to fix them. So which is it - an oversight or you purposely f###ing me?

From: todd Bailey <[email protected]>
To:rpm3000
Sent: Sunday, December 18, 2011 7:38 PM
Subject: Re: Question regarding GunBroker.com Item

We have built done guns on these kits with full. Warranty for $1250 other smiths charge up to $800 to assemble kits if u want we will take your kit and for $250 we will complete it test fire it and return it to u but we sold these as is for $750 so others who know what they are doing finish them up we sold 750 kits we have one left that is it. We will not do finishing work on these for free hkparts sells a bolt head and carrier for more the we sell the whole gun for. Also most of the junk bolt parts u got were made by RCM yes they were and they refuse to stand behind the junk they sold me 5 years ago. Post that on hk pro. Didn't think so!!!!


Let me know what u want to do
Sent from my iPhone

From: Wendy Bailey <[email protected]>
To: rpm3000
Sent: Monday, December 19, 2011 11:12 AM
Subject: Re: Question regarding GunBroker.com Item

$75 TO HAVE THE BARREL UPPER DONE OVER WHAT WE CHARGE FOR THE UNASSEMBLED KITS so we are not about to send you $800 on a kit you spent $700 so you can have Gilly and Chop sticks bitch about it when it is only a $250 final assembly deal


all our grips from day one have been 9mm that need to be cut to 40 that is part of the it is an unfinished KIT for $750 that it or leave it we have one left your bitching is not going to kill sales they are all sold all our new 40 cal and 10mm stuff is 100% made by us NO RCM junk made on gen 5 receivers that are perfect there are NOT the give away $750 but they also are not made with RCM junk and half assembled by vector monkeys

Let me know you have one week to accept the offer after that you are as the auction says AS IS



I wouldn't buy $100 bills from this guy if he was selling them for a dime.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Well, I knew going into this that I'd probably have to spend a little more money because that's just how the clone game is played. No big deal. I like the Bellator and would probably end up upgrading parts anyway in the future just to ensure the best combination of parts and long-term reliability of the thing. As it stands, I'm in for $1,500 and have a perfectly working sp89 copy (although I've only fired 2 mags full so far with the rcm parts, both of which were perfect 30 round dumps).

My biggest concern is whether or not the .024 gap I'm currently using will end up being to the detriment of the receiver in the long-term. if not, then I'll go have some fun and probably get it all straightened out sometime in the future with a 3 lug barrel set at proper headspace with the right parts and factory rollers. If it's a major problem, then I may swap barrels right now.
 

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Too small of a gap ang you can start beating up the receiver. Too big of a gap and you get light primer strikes. Measuring the gap on a 9mm can be a little tricky because any force will open up the gap and give a false reading. You have to make sure the bolt is locked tight and then measure the gap without putting any angle or force on the feeler gauge. If the reading is accurate and it's running fine, you are probably good to go.
 

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there are question to be raised with everything that comes out of his shed i posted a while a thread about spotwelds with there oh so awsome setup that were not fused mr todd claimed that nonfused spotwelds are completly normal and,i did not know what i was talking about, and that i was a liar asswipe and whatmore his parts,products and personality are cheap. and that is what you get if you this pistol a cheap lowend firearm with the possibilty of a moneytrap to make it work right.
 
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