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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
(UPDATE! SEE BOTTOM OF THIS POST)

Hey everybody I was hoping you can help me out. I bought an HK for the reliability and great reputation.

I finally got a chance to take a shot with my brand new VP9SK and it had a malfunction (on the very first shot out of the brand new pistol...)
Failure to feed.

There are upgrades that COULD have interfered, and possibly caused this malfunction, however, I HIGHLY doubt it, because I spared no expense and got only the best upgrades possible.

1. Threaded barrel, the same one you get on HK parts
2. Lazy Wolf f3 trigger system
3. Lazy wolf duty/carry reduced power spring set. Set included a reduced trigger pull spring, down to 3.5 lb. And a reduced power sear spring.
(4. It also has an upgraded extended aluminum mag release-however I feel to see how that would have anything to do with a malfunction of this type.)

I welcome any and all advice, this experience has me more than a little disheartened.

I keep thinking- "what if I was in a defensive encounter and this happened?"
IN THAT INSTANCE, I WOULD BE THINKING TO MYSELF:
"I have a high quality and reliable pistol, high quality ammunition, and the best upgrades money can buy, (darn near $1,500 into the gun and upgrades combined), I would expect it to cycle properly... ESPECIALLY being brand new! BUT, if I had gotten into a defensive encounter, and faced returning fire from my adversary, there's a great chance I would turn out dead."

Not very comforting! I'd appreciate any and all advice, criticism, and assistance you all can provide.

(I AM GOOD WITH MACHINES AND MECHANICAL OBJECTS INCLUDING FIREARMS. JUST HAVE A KNACK FOR IT. SO I CAN HANDLE ADVANCED ADVICE. NOT A GUNSMITH, BUT I HAVE ALL THE TOOLS AND RESOURCES TO DO ALMOST ANYTHING HERE AT MY HOUSE SO PLEASE DON'T SPARE THE DETAILS!)

I've included several pictures below in case it helps. They are a little blurry in order to protect the serial number. But they should be clear enough for you to get a good feel for what is taking place.

PLEASE HELP!

THANK YOU VERY MUCH

____
UPDATE EVERYONE:

I REPLACED THE THREADED WITH THE ORIGINAL BARREL, FIRED, AND I'M HAPPY TO SAY THE GUN CYCLES BEAUTIFULLY! With almost no kick at all I might add. I'm already in love with this gun :)

With the threaded barrel in, working the slide back slowly, with a full magazine loaded, then working the slide forward just as slowly, sometimes I am able to simulate the jam.

It is as if the slide is not going back far enough to fully grab the next round. I think it has to do with what the majority of knowledgeable people have been saying on this thread which is that brand new HK guide rod / return spring(s) needs to be broken in.

Probably going to end this thread soon, I've learned a lot and had the opportunity to speak to some really amazing people. But I think I've learned what I needed. So if anyone else has any commentary, advice, criticism or anything else, speak up now! :)

Thanks again to everyone who participated.

Brian K

_

Brian K
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HK’s come with pretty stiff recoil springs. The frames rub the slide a little when new also. It usually takes a few hundred rounds to break them in.
Limp wristing is also a known culprit in polymer framed handguns.
The barrel might have a different profile feed ramp compared to the factory one? Maybe even a fitting issue?
Aftermarket magazine release could have magazine riding a little high putting more pressure on the slide?
Sometimes aftermarket parts don’t have the qc of the factory parts. Or they just aren’t as good.
Personally, I’d put it back to stock & break it in with a few hundred rounds. Then, change things out one at a time. Function testing after every part change. Once everything is running 100%, function & accuracy testing with self defense ammo.
Hope you get it worked out.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
HK’s come with pretty stiff recoil springs. The frames rub the slide a little when new also. It usually takes a few hundred rounds to break them in.
Limp wristing is also a known culprit in polymer framed handguns.
The barrel might have a different profile feed ramp compared to the factory one? Maybe even a fitting issue?
Aftermarket magazine release could have magazine riding a little high putting more pressure on the slide?
Sometimes aftermarket parts don’t have the qc of the factory parts. Or they just aren’t as good.
Personally, I’d put it back to stock & break it in with a few hundred rounds. Then, change things out one at a time. Function testing after every part change. Once everything is running 100%, function & accuracy testing with self defense ammo.
Hope you get it worked out.

Thank you,

Wow that makes so much sense I am truly humbled. As I was reading each sentence and paragraph I was saying to myself, "of course, why didn't I think of that?".

I've heard about the break-in., Especially with HKs. Guess I forgot. Not something you want to forget!

It could be some of the parts, you're right. Adding them all at once borders on foolish when it's a brand new gun. I completely see your point.

I will return it to stock, put a good 200 rounds at least through it, get it broken in. Then do as you suggested, add one part at a time, maybe even take notes on the changes I noticed. So that way if there is a problem with a particular aftermarket part, or if it was simply the break-in process, I will be able to continue without any worries.

After reading your comment, I couldn't help but wonder if it was 100% stock, would there have been a malfunction? I got feeling says no.

Thanks again, that is exactly the kind of information that I needed to hear.

Brian K
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
By the way when you say limp wristing, What does that mean? Are you referring to my grip on the gun?

If so, I highly doubt it. Not to sound full of myself because I'm absolutely not an urban person, I don't think that was the problem. I've got a really good grip :) and I've adjusted all of the grip panels to fit my hand perfectly.

It was a very secure two-handed shot. HOWEVER, I know there's always room to improve, and I suppose it is possible that it was a user error.

Based on what you said about the break-in process and the stock parts, my gut tells me that that is the culprit.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
I like the idea of locking the slide back for a day to break the springs in a little. And the plus p would certainly save money on the break-in process.

Very creative solutions :) Thank you

I think this may be one of those situations where there is simply no substitute for doing it the right way the first time, and then adding on.

Got to walk before you can run, seems to be What I need to do.

Thanks again
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
So based on the information I received from @rc51pete I believe I know what I need to do.

Return the gun to stock, break it in with at least 200 rounds.
and then add an upgraded part, one at a time and run a good amount of rounds through the gun to make sure the part is working in concert with the rest of the action.
Then repeat. with each upgrade, one at a time.

So that's where I'm at now.

If anyone still has any information they think would be valuable or just want to let a new HK owner know some things that I don't know but need to know, I welcome any and all additional advice!
 

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Based on what is described, my gut is saying it is either the after market barrel, extended mag release or both.
I think it’s probably the after market mag release. If the part of the release that interacts with the mag is off at all after the first shot the mag will drop lower in the grip than it should. When the next round is stripped out of the mag it tilts up at a higher angle than it should. I have seen this happen at the range with after market mag releases that are out of spec and the jams had the angles yours have.

Assuming you have some snap caps or other dummy rounds laying around I would put the factory barrel back in and cycle some snap caps through it. If it feeds correctly you know it is either the barrel or tolerance stacking.

Then you need to put the after market barrel back in and switch to the stock mag release. Then cycle some snap caps through it. If this combo functions then you know the problem is tolerance stacking and you can only run either the barrel or after market mag release, not both.

if neither of these works put in both the factory barrel and mag release and run the snap caps through. If that works then the problem is solved and both after market parts are out of spec and can’t be used. If it still doesn’t work at this point you messed something up some where and need to return to factory.

Doing it this way will take 10=15 minutes to determine the most likely two culprits, instead of having to do a detail strip, how ever long that takes you.
 

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HK pistols are engineered to operate on Nato 124 grain loads
this is what i was about to add.

OP:
i would return the pistol to stock and fire a couple boxes of 124gr ammo and then if you feel the need to start replacing the parts that work, do so one at a time.

this is my humble opinion but His are designed to have a bunch or parts replaced like "other popular polymer pistols" that have everything thing under the sun made by thousands of various companies.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Based on what is described, my gut is saying it is either the after market barrel, extended mag release or both.
I think it’s probably the after market mag release. If the part of the release that interacts with the mag is off at all after the first shot the mag will drop lower in the grip than it should. When the next round is stripped out of the mag it tilts up at a higher angle than it should. I have seen this happen at the range with after market mag releases that are out of spec and the jams had the angles yours have.

Assuming you have some snap caps or other dummy rounds laying around I would put the factory barrel back in and cycle some snap caps through it. If it feeds correctly you know it is either the barrel or tolerance stacking.

Then you need to put the after market barrel back in and switch to the stock mag release. Then cycle some snap caps through it. If this combo functions then you know the problem is tolerance stacking and you can only run either the barrel or after market mag release, not both.

if neither of these works put in both the factory barrel and mag release and run the snap caps through. If that works then the problem is solved and both after market parts are out of spec and can’t be used. If it still doesn’t work at this point you messed something up some where and need to return to factory.

Doing it this way will take 10=15 minutes to determine the most likely two culprits, instead of having to do a detail strip, how ever long that takes you.
Very insightful. Thanks a lot. You know, I cycle both live rounds and dummy rounds through both barrels with the mag release and I use 10 round, 13 round, 15 round, and 20 round, all HK OEM magazines, and it all cycles beautifully- in a dry fire sense. I even try to MAKE it fail with a weird slide pull and release, if you know what I mean.

Something about what you said really struck me though:
The angle of the bullet was extremely vertical. Which would support what you were saying about the mag dropping possibly because the geometry is wrong with the extended mag release. (And in conjunction with the aftermarket barrel it made just create a dysfunctional process).

I also appreciate your approach when it comes to the testing.

I'm getting such a wealth of information on this site I'm so glad I found it. Thank you so much for your insight full commentary :)

Brian K
HK pistols are engineered to operate on Nato 124 grain loads
Please excuse me ignorance. I don't know much about grains when it comes to ammunition. Are you saying that this pistol cannot handle plus pee rounds? What exactly are you trying to say?

Thanks
 

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Very insightful. Thanks a lot. You know, I cycle both live rounds and dummy rounds through both barrels with the mag release and I use 10 round, 13 round, 15 round, and 20 round, all HK OEM magazines, and it all cycles beautifully- in a dry fire sense. I even try to MAKE it fail with a weird slide pull and release, if you know what I mean.

Something about what you said really struck me though:
The angle of the bullet was extremely vertical. Which would support what you were saying about the mag dropping possibly because the geometry is wrong with the extended mag release. (And in conjunction with the aftermarket barrel it made just create a dysfunctional process).

I also appreciate your approach when it comes to the testing.

I'm getting such a wealth of information on this site I'm so glad I found it. Thank you so much for your insight full commentary :)

Brian K

Please excuse me ignorance. I don't know much about grains when it comes to ammunition. Are you saying that this pistol cannot handle plus pee rounds? What exactly are you trying to say?


Thanks
the weight of the bullet. most common 9mm ammo is 115 gr and what most people use because the 124 gr bullets are a few dollars more than the 115 gr
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
this is what i was about to add.

OP:
i would return the pistol to stock and fire a couple boxes of 124gr ammo and then if you feel the need to start replacing the parts that work, do so one at a time.

this is my humble opinion but His are designed to have a bunch or parts replaced like "other popular polymer pistols" that have everything thing under the sun made by thousands of various companies.
Thank you for the advice!

That is the general theme I seem to be gathering. I do plan to return it to stock and fire about 200 rounds through it based on The majority of advice.

I do want to comment on but you said about the attachments:
I knew before I bought this gun EXACTLY which manufacturers I was going with for each part and WHY.
The threaded barrel was a must as I run compensators and suppressors.
After doing extensive research about the stock trigger including update break and over travel, I decided it was insufficient. Additionally, I wanted to lower the pole resistance.
The lazy wolf trigger is endorsed by an HK brand ambassador whom I trust. And I've watched many videos and learned a lot about the lazy wolf trigger system and I have to say, in my humble opinion, it is superior to the stock trigger.
The spring set just seemed like a logical choice and being the same brand I thought it would be a good pairing.

It's not trying to advocate that HK's are like other polymer pistols and should be upgraded willy-nilly style, just trying to communicate that I didn't do this at random and there was a lot of research and reasoning that went into every purchase end upgrade.

The only thing I put on after I got the gun that I am unsure about is the extended mag release. It gets in the way of the knuckle of your middle finger as you grip the pistol. I imagine successive shots would hurt. So, I just wanted to explain why I put everything in at once. I had planned on this purchase and the upgrades for quite some time :)

I do acknowledge and respect what you mean when you say that they're not meant to have a bunch of aftermarket parts from all sorts of different manufacturers and end up looking like some g19!

They're made well, so don't mess with it. I understand that. But this is as far as I will go. Nothing else needs to be replaced. I see what people have been saying, and because of the way that it malfunctioned, I do believe it is either the barrel or the mag release.
Probably the mag release because if the mag isn't seated up high enough it would cause the exact type of problem that I observed.

In regards to the barrel, I did a meticulous side by side analysis of the stock barrel and this barrel and they are all but identical. Measurements are spot on, maybe a micron off here or there. So what I'm trying to say is I'm satisfied with the quality of the trigger system, springs and barrel.

But I am UNCERTAIN about this mag release. I think it is the culprit personally.

I will definitely do as you and others have suggested,
1. return it to stock.
2. put a bunch of rounds through it, give it a chance to break in,
3. and then like you said if I feel the need to replace a part, I will do so then,
4. one at a time.

Something I am curious about is the grain load that someone else mentioned. So what type of ammunition should I get ideally? Can this weapon not run special rounds like plus p? It was my understanding HK's were quite capable when it came to that sort of thing. I'd love to hear more if someone has something to offer in regards to ammunition and grains?

Thanks so much for your advice, I really appreciate it!

Brian
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
the weight of the bullet. most common 9mm ammo is 115 gr and what most people use because the 124 gr bullets are a few dollars more than the 115 gr
Oh I see like cutting corners. Not something I like to do! So just to be clear you are saying that 124 grand bullets are the only type that HK should run ideally??
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Very insightful. Thanks a lot. You know, I cycle both live rounds and dummy rounds through both barrels with the mag release and I use 10 round, 13 round, 15 round, and 20 round, all HK OEM magazines, and it all cycles beautifully- in a dry fire sense. I even try to MAKE it fail with a weird slide pull and release, if you know what I mean.

Something about what you said really struck me though:
The angle of the bullet was extremely vertical. Which would support what you were saying about the mag dropping possibly because the geometry is wrong with the extended mag release. (And in conjunction with the aftermarket barrel it made just create a dysfunctional process).

I also appreciate your approach when it comes to the testing.

I'm getting such a wealth of information on this site I'm so glad I found it. Thank you so much for your insight full commentary :)

Brian K

Please excuse me ignorance. I don't know much about grains when it comes to ammunition. Are you saying that this pistol cannot handle plus pee rounds? What exactly are you trying to say?

Thanks
Thanks anyway, someone else explained it for me. I understand now. Thank you very much for your advice!
 

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Thank you for the advice!

That is the general theme I seem to be gathering. I do plan to return it to stock and fire about 200 rounds through it based on The majority of advice.

I do want to comment on but you said about the attachments:
I knew before I bought this gun EXACTLY which manufacturers I was going with for each part and WHY.
The threaded barrel was a must as I run compensators and suppressors.
After doing extensive research about the stock trigger including update break and over travel, I decided it was insufficient. Additionally, I wanted to lower the pole resistance.
The lazy wolf trigger is endorsed by an HK brand ambassador whom I trust. And I've watched many videos and learned a lot about the lazy wolf trigger system and I have to say, in my humble opinion, it is superior to the stock trigger.
The spring set just seemed like a logical choice and being the same brand I thought it would be a good pairing.

It's not trying to advocate that HK's are like other polymer pistols and should be upgraded willy-nilly style, just trying to communicate that I didn't do this at random and there was a lot of research and reasoning that went into every purchase end upgrade.

The only thing I put on after I got the gun that I am unsure about is the extended mag release. It gets in the way of the knuckle of your middle finger as you grip the pistol. I imagine successive shots would hurt. So, I just wanted to explain why I put everything in at once. I had planned on this purchase and the upgrades for quite some time :)

I do acknowledge and respect what you mean when you say that they're not meant to have a bunch of aftermarket parts from all sorts of different manufacturers and end up looking like some g19!

They're made well, so don't mess with it. I understand that. But this is as far as I will go. Nothing else needs to be replaced. I see what people have been saying, and because of the way that it malfunctioned, I do believe it is either the barrel or the mag release.
Probably the mag release because if the mag isn't seated up high enough it would cause the exact type of problem that I observed.

In regards to the barrel, I did a meticulous side by side analysis of the stock barrel and this barrel and they are all but identical. Measurements are spot on, maybe a micron off here or there. So what I'm trying to say is I'm satisfied with the quality of the trigger system, springs and barrel.

But I am UNCERTAIN about this mag release. I think it is the culprit personally.

I will definitely do as you and others have suggested,
1. return it to stock.
2. put a bunch of rounds through it, give it a chance to break in,
3. and then like you said if I feel the need to replace a part, I will do so then,
4. one at a time.

Something I am curious about is the grain load that someone else mentioned. So what type of ammunition should I get ideally? Can this weapon not run special rounds like plus p? It was my understanding HK's were quite capable when it came to that sort of thing. I'd love to hear more if someone has something to offer in regards to ammunition and grains?

Thanks so much for your advice, I really appreciate it!

Brian
Your numbers 1-4 are the way to go. HK manuals say Saami spec ammo which would include 115 grain but HK CS has suggested 124gr. I have shot thousands of rounds thru VP9/VP9SK and the great bulk of that has been 115 just because it was cheaper. The guns were “broken in” with 115 exclusively for the first 3000 or so I’d not more. Two local agencies use VPs and the range ammo for them is 115gr and no break in procedure is followed. That said, the guns never gave me any issue. I am also aware of no problems with the Agency guns. If they did, I would try 124. But with what you have done to the gun, I’m guessing it’s the mods. Probably the barrel but the other suggestions are definitely candidates. I also rank HK OEM barrels above any aftermarket barrels for the VP.
Good luck. VPs are a blast and extremely reliable. Again, 1-4.👍
 
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