HKPRO Forums banner

1 - 20 of 39 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
478 Posts
Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
I wanted to start another thread pretaining to my range review of the weapon. This would make it easier for people to navigate and not to make the post so long.

For my initial impressions and close up pictures of the weapon, please goto this post: http://hkpro.com/forum/showthread.php?t=74528

So, I just got back from the range about 5 mins ago. I know everyone's very anxious to hear my results.

Results:
I think overall it was a success!! However, the gun did NOT run 100%. I fired 350 rounds through the weapon and had 6 FTE's. Now hold your horses for those itching to bash on the weapon quickly. I believe the FTE's were AMMO related as they were only from my lightly loaded reloads. I made the mistake of having too much faith in my reloads to function 100% without load development and only brought 150 rounds of factory ammo. Only more testing can tell if it was indeed ammo related or just the weapon itself.

Breakdown:
Ammo used:
-Sellier & Bellot 180gr FMJ, Winchester white box 180gr FMJ, & my reloads

Magazine:
-HK MP5-10/40 magazine

I fired 100 rounds of Sellier & Bellot 180gr FMJ through the weapon without a hitch. Ejection was consistent, landed 9-10 feet @ 3 o' clock from shooter's position. This S&B Chrono'd at 945 FPS out of my USP Compact 40.

I fired another 50 rounds of Winchester white box 180gr FMJ also without a hitch. Ejection was not as consistent as the S&B, although still 3 o' clock to shooters position but about 6-7 feet away from me.

I then fired 150 rounds of my "medium" reloads. 180gr Rainer FP, 6.5gr of Power pistol, WSP primer, OAL @ 1.130". These chrono'd @ 960 FPS out of my USP Compact 40. Ejection was pretty consistent, landed 9-10 feet @ 3 o' clock from shooter's position.

What I think went wrong:
I fired 50 rounds of my lightly loaded 180gr Rainer FP rounds. 4.5grs of Titegroup, WSP primer, OAL @ 1.130". These ejected very short, maybe 3 feet away from me, also 3 o' clock. I had 6 rounds that failed to extract properly, which made it's way between the bolt head and ejector lever. This prevented the bolt to go back into battery and strip the next round.

These loads are quite light when I chrono'ed them in my USP compact 40. I average 900 FPS with that load. The S&B, chrono'ed at an average of 945 FPS.

Of course, this is only speculation, but I think being loaded lightly may have had something to do with functionality to the weapon. I don't know as I do not have another MP5/40 to test this on. Please chime in if you have any info that may contradict this.

Accuracy:
I am very pleased with the weapon's accuracy. It is much more accurate than I am. I was able to shoot a 3" grouping at 15 yards consistently. Of course with the nature of the pistol configuration, I will need more practice to shoot tighter groups. It was also very soft shooting and very tamable recoil. I definitely cannot wait untill I send in my Form 1 to SBR this thing as I know it will make it 100% more fun to shoot. Last round bold hold open also worked everytime without any fuss.

Spent brass:
One thing that I noticed was that the weapon seems to be harsh on the spent brass. Lots of my spent casing has very distorted shapes. I'm wondering if I should even try to reload the spent casing out of my the weapon. Since this is my only MP5/40 type weapon, could others out there chime in on this?

Picture of spent casing:



Internals looks great. Nothing unusual or out of the ordinary from what I can tell.

Picture of internals after 350rds:





My throughts:
Overall I am happy that it did run decent today with the factory ammo and one batch of my reloads. I am disappointed that I did not have more ammo with me or that I did not load any hotter loads. I am still new with this weapon system, so I am not sure if the locking piece may have something to do with these loads? Should the #24 'LO' locking piece should be able to handle everything thrown at it? Or should I change locking pieces according to ammo load?

Just for data collection, I will leave the weapon AS IS and run more ammo through it, hotter loads, lighter loads, and factory loads. However, after data collection, I will be changing out the extractor, extractor spring, ejector lever, & ejector lever spring. Adam has all that for $115.00 bucks. But so far, I do not have a real reason to change those out besides doing it just to do it.

So far, I think that should be everything. If I missed anything, please feel free to chime in and I will report back. But for now, I think that's sufficient.

I will continue to keep everyone updated on my success/failure with the CA89-40. I will make another trip to the range next weekend and report back.

Cheers,
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
58 Posts
Zepheris,

Congrats!!!! Sounds like you've got a winner. Great write-up and I look forward to seeing the updates.

'duck
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
2,247 Posts
Good for you Bro. I'm happy that it ran well.


Regards,

r.


That's the most important thing is whether it will run or not. I think 6 FTE on an out of the box clone is "great"
 

·
H&K Certified Armorer
Joined
·
8,213 Posts
Ditto! Glad to hear things went well with it! Again, congrats... and ANOTHER great wirte-up!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
864 Posts
That was a GREAT write up! MP5 platform actually doesnt like light loads. Nature of the beast so I am not surprised that your lighter loads didnt cycle the gun properly. There is nothing to be surprised about there. As for the casings, well that seems a little odd. I personally have ZERO experience with the 40 cal varriants, however combined with what i know and what I have read, I think there might be an overly agressive extraction issue here. I'm sure one of the more experienced guys will chime in too about this.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,398 Posts
Glad to hear it went well. Nice to see the parts all in order and healthy. Give them the best of oils. ;)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
478 Posts
Discussion Starter #7
Thanks guys. I am very glad it actually ran too. I was dreading the possibility I go out there and have constant issues with fail to fire, failt to extract, and fail to feed issues all day long. I was under the same impression that the MP5 platform would not like light loads either but I was unsure of which locking piece is good for what type of loads.

I'll give it a through cleaning then hit the range again next weekend. I will keep everyone updated on the progress of the weapon and what parts I upgrade and if they made a difference.

Please keep the comments & questions coming if I left anything out.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,398 Posts
Thanks guys. I am very glad it actually ran too. I was dreading the possibility I go out there and have constant issues with fail to fire, failt to extract, and fail to feed issues all day long. I was under the same impression that the MP5 platform would not like light loads either but I was unsure of which locking piece is good for what type of loads.

I'll give it a through cleaning then hit the range again next weekend. I will keep everyone updated on the progress of the weapon and what parts I upgrade and if they made a difference.

Please keep the comments & questions coming if I left anything out.
Which range did you go to? If I had realized that you were a local, I might have gone along to watch the fun. ;)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
452 Posts
Very well written reports. I have a CA94 in 9mm and my story is the same. The shell casings in your pics look just like mine. I used Speer Golddot 147 gr and Remington Sub-sonic 147 gr. The shells exit in all different directions...but who cares. The CA94 is a blast to shoot! Also, I have a few FTE on my first 1000rds, but that was fixed with a 9mm hammer spring and HK ejector.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
452 Posts
Also, I had to clean it after the first 700rds. It just could not take any more rounds properly. Just too dirty. Hope that helps.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
478 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
Which range did you go to? If I had realized that you were a local, I might have gone along to watch the fun. ;)
I just now noticed after you mentioned it :). I went to american shooting centers.

To iloveHK, I am glad to hear that your impressions were the same. All it took was a hammer spring and extractor to cure your FTE problems? Did you run into any other problems with the CA94?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
864 Posts
Im kinda shocked that no one has chimed in about the extraction and casing deformation yet. Not to distract anyone. Im glad she's a runner and Im glad you are happy with your purchase. Im thinking something needs a tweak, tho, and so I think it would serve the general purpose of your report to kinda try and get a handle on a more definitive answer.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
478 Posts
Discussion Starter #13
Im kinda shocked that no one has chimed in about the extraction and casing deformation yet. Not to distract anyone. Im glad she's a runner and Im glad you are happy with your purchase. Im thinking something needs a tweak, tho, and so I think it would serve the general purpose of your report to kinda try and get a handle on a more definitive answer.

Someone mentioned that they're casing looks very similar to mine out of a 9mm CA94. Looks like it is consistent with the Cohaire weapons, but no one has chimed in about how the real MP5's treat the spent casings.

Also, after emailing TB about the extraction issues, he told me that the gun needs about 1000rds to break in to see if the problem may go away. He also pointed out that my impressions on the mounting tabs were incorrect. He said that the mounting tabs are in spec, one squared and one at an angle. It was designed for HK claw mounts that cams into poisition. I have no prior exprience to this as I do not hear anyone talk about the mounting tab angles. I only assumed that it'd be logical for the tabs to be squared with the gun. Can someone with a real MP5 platform chime in on this?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,398 Posts
Someone mentioned that they're casing looks very similar to mine out of a 9mm CA94. Looks like it is consistent with the Cohaire weapons, but no one has chimed in about how the real MP5's treat the spent casings.

Also, after emailing TB about the extraction issues, he told me that the gun needs about 1000rds to break in to see if the problem may go away. He also pointed out that my impressions on the mounting tabs were incorrect. He said that the mounting tabs are in spec, one squared and one at an angle. It was designed for HK claw mounts that cams into poisition. I have no prior exprience to this as I do not hear anyone talk about the mounting tab angles. I only assumed that it'd be logical for the tabs to be squared with the gun. Can someone with a real MP5 platform chime in on this?
I have a real HK91 at home (I'm at work now). I'll check it tonight and see if it's got something similar.

Edit: I can't tell from your pictures how they are not square. Can you explain it a bit more to me?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
478 Posts
Discussion Starter #15
I have a real HK91 at home (I'm at work now). I'll check it tonight and see if it's got something similar.

Edit: I can't tell from your pictures how they are not square. Can you explain it a bit more to me?
The mounting tabs on the left side of the weapon has an angle to the bottom mounting surface, where a claw mount or mount would attach itself to. On the right side of the weapon, the mounting surface is 90 degrees to the receiver. It's hard for me to explain in words, but if you looked at your mounting tabs, you should be able to see the difference.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
2,247 Posts
In my experience that's normal. You're not going to be reloading brass from a properly tuned MP5 variant.


Regrds,
r
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
2,247 Posts
I checked my tabs and they're the same as your's are. I thinks it's fot the HK claw mount they're angled to kind of roll in on and then tighten it with the clamp. It's supposed to be able to be done quickly.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
407 Posts
Jeff Hoffman of Black Hills ammunition told me a few years back that they rejected used brass that had been fired in fluted chamber HK's and would not use it for production of their reloaded ammunition.

He said something about the flutes and pressure "work hardening the brass and making it weaker".

I have had a couple of HK-94 SBR's with Urbach NON-FLUTED barrels and they functioned PERFECTLY and the brass was reloaded by me just fine.

Darin Reiss
FFL/SOT in KS
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
478 Posts
Discussion Starter #19
I checked my tabs and they're the same as your's are. I thinks it's fot the HK claw mount they're angled to kind of roll in on and then tighten it with the clamp. It's supposed to be able to be done quickly.
I am glad to hear that this was not something that was out of spec. I was worried because I wanted to put an Aimpoint on my clone and was concerned about how the B&T low mount would mount properly or not.

From the looks of my spent brass, I wouldn't really feel comfortable reloading them again. They definitely will resize fine, but I'm not sure how hard it'll be working the brass, especially when loaded hot. Maybe another loading or 2 would be fine. That's crap, since I'll be shooting most out of this thing :(
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
452 Posts
I just now noticed after you mentioned it :). I went to american shooting centers.

To iloveHK, I am glad to hear that your impressions were the same. All it took was a hammer spring and extractor to cure your FTE problems? Did you run into any other problems with the CA94?
After the hammer spring and extractor, she was sweet as honey. I love shooting the damn thing. After replacing the .308 spring with a 9mm spring, and a HK ejector lever, she was smooth as a baby's butt. I'm sorry, it was the ejector, not extractor that I replaced.
 
1 - 20 of 39 Posts
Top