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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I tried browsing some of the threads but didn't find a distinct answer. Earlier this year (around late January, early February) I pulled the trigger on an MM21E specifically for California (with a little block in place et c), that I can use as a sear host sometimes. I understood from correspondence that the mechanical work was finished some time in April but a very large (10,000 part!) order for parkerizing was being done and I would have to wait.

Fast forward to August, and the large order was not yet completed. I've done manganese phosphate on M1 receivers as well as as other types of finishing and while I can appreciate doing things right the first time, it struck me as strange that it would take 4+ months to do the work... then again I'm sure that with this being an election year and on top of obviously doing other sales and builds, that things can take time. I received an email here from Mike that he could "safely say early Sept. at the latest".

September and October come and go and with a few phone calls, each time I'm told that it would be delivered that month. Indeed I was initially told that the estimated time for build and delivery was around 12-14 weeks, and we're in week 30 something now. Responses to emails grew nonexistent during the summer, so I switched to calling each month to check on progress as that was getting an answer.

It is now half way through November. A recent phone call (last week) had assured me that it would be done this month "easily", however I remain skeptical. I know that the workmanship is worth the wait, however I am under a deadline here. In California, come Jan 1st, the MM21E will not be transferable to me anymore in a "bullet button" state, making this a great deal of wasted time, money, and effort. It would be perfectly possible to register it during the amnesty period the following year, however importing it into the state become impossible unless it is "featureless", which I'm not sure can be done with an MM21E in such a way as to preserve the normal features for sear use or out of state use.

Any advice from other MM customers? It is difficult to receive responses directly from Mike (or any employees at MM) via email and I dislike bothering people at work by phone needlessly. I also cannot PM him here as I do not have the required 5 posts.

Thank you for your attention.
 

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I would call Mike at the number listed on his website. Every time I have called him he has answered the phone personally. I have purchased two different builds from him as well as a few parts and have had no issues. My builds took several months and the quality of his work is excellent. Hope you get it resolved by your deadline.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 · (Edited)
I would call Mike at the number listed on his website. Every time I have called him he has answered the phone personally. I have purchased two different builds from him as well as a few parts and have had no issues. My builds took several months and the quality of his work is excellent. Hope you get it resolved by your deadline.
I have. Much like Bill Springfield taking several months to deliver some parts I've ordered, quality work takes time and skill. But it's less "several months" and more "10 months and change"; and while I can appreciate the efforts, the better part of a year is a little long in the tooth to miss multiple promises of shipment (from email and phone).

It's a less a question of quality or delivery, but more on the time being unreasonable - if I'm very wrong in my expectations for an MM21E build to take 10 months, I'll happily apologize for misunderstanding the initial estimated date of completion. I was curious if other customers for the MM21E have had similar delays and I should not be worried about my deadline or since I know they got busy with a large order, SHOT, and the Knob Creek shoot if I should have placed an order 2 years prior.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Add a grip warp and remove flash hider convert your beltfed to featureless. That's how FNH M249s are being sold in CA.
I would, if the product was available to be shipped at all. Last I understood my MM21E is awaiting finishing... some time back in April of this year. I do appreciate you raising the point that if this drags into the new year that a featureless import and registration during the 2017 period would be an option - something I have forgotten, actually.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
To beat the 2016 deadline, talk to your CA FFL if they accept receiver only transfer. If they do, ask Mike to ship receiver first. After the transfer you can send it back to complete the build.
A very good point - I believe Mike did offer to do this around early summer, but I deferred at the time. Should this continue through December I will see my options. Thank you for your insightful suggestions.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
I've received a shipping notice from Mike's, so it seems that like with any quality-focused business, he's making sure he does things correctly the first time around, even if it takes a bit longer than most.
 

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I've sent Mike:

1) A cashier's check for $24,859 in March 2015 for an MM21 and MM23.
2) My DLO box for modification in April 2016.
3) And 60 rounds of Israeli 5.56 ammo for test firing in April 2016.
Here we are in the end of November 2016 and I have not seen anything yet!

I understand that manufacturing and production delays can occur but this is silly.


I just sent Mike an email today stating that I want my money back, if he can't deliver the MM21 and MM23 by March 2017.
 

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There are lots of things that can cause delays and that is the nature of this business.
Some people realize what is actually involved in making my guns. There are lots of
manufactures that have licenses on here but really aren't manufacturers.
They do nice work but are mostly parts assemblers. Do they make from scratch the parts they are assembling?
Mainly NO. 95% plus of the parts of my belt-feds are made from scratch. Then they are assembled.
There is me and my brother in law (which has a full time job) for my production.
Imagine 10 thousand parts that have to be blasted (most individually) and that amount pakerized etc.
That is just the feed mech. alone ............ plus all the other parts /molds etc.
Everybody gets their guns.
I could have deleted this thread but wanted to give some insight to what is involved in my business.
Thanks to the many hundreds of satisfied and future customers for your support.
Mike Otte
 

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Mike, i sent you an email. I just want to confirm you will be putting the rail on my hk beltfed.
I have no problem waiting, but if it will be as extended wait, let do the paperwork on the mp5 sbr as soon as possible.

I had been temped to buy some of your guns used from private parties but with no cost saving and not having my sear yet there's no rush.
For anyone who doesnt want to wait,serveral have been poping up for sale.

Sorry i didnt PM you i dont have enough posts to PM
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 · (Edited)
Congrats, welcome to the club. You may think about a MM23/21EK down the road so buy a receiver from MM first, you still have time to get it transfer.
Indeed, although I think if I did that I will get a parts kit (barrel, bolt carrier group, feed assembly) rather than an entire new firearm. Gives me an excuse to buy a barrel carrying case.

And further I would like to reinterate that Mike's communique's have been helpful (if rare) and cordial, and the realities of manufacturing and running a business and having a life makes things very difficult - not to mention dealing with regulatory agencies and promoting your products. I had no question of quality or that I would never see a firearm - my concern was centered on my unique time line with California's insanity. I'm very sure that all his customers will receive their orders in due time... although that time might be a little long in the tooth.
 

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I took possession of the MM 21E and the MM 23E on 3/27/17. I finally got a chance to shoot both full auto with the DLO box that Mike modified. It was awesome and I'm very happy with the build quality! Mike threw in some links and 2 cases at no charge for my wait. Thank you Mike and I'm looking forward to the MM22!
 

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He does fantastic work and 21/23e's manufactured from the ground up still pretty much a grand slam in the clone market.
 
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