[bsafe]

I've done a search and I cannot find the weight of the recoil spring in the HK 45. I know the whole assembly is different than the USP system and those are the only springs I can seem to find any info for. I'm specifically interested to know if there are lighter power or extra power models available.

 

[Apollo11]

I don't know the weight, but have never seen different power springs for sale. The gun was not meant to be tinkered with like a 1911, so I don't think HK has much of an interest in making items to customize it's combat pistol.

 

[texasgun]

the stock HK45 recoil spring set-up is solid. no need to tinker around with that. I once bought a "recoil spring reducer" for my kimber but it does sh*t.... so while for 1911s you can put in softer or stiffer springs, the HK45 needs no modifications.

 

[DBLAction454]

If it ain't broke don't fix it

 

[bsafe]

The pistol has already been "tinkered with" by replacing the wonderful stock sights with Heinie Straight Eights, getting a light LEM without the safety/decocker, re stippling the grip and back straps, and sending to Bruce Grey for trigger and internal work. It's gotten better each time. I know the 1911 platform has been around for a century, but that does not preclude manufacture of variable parts for newer platforms. Wolff sells a variety of spring weights for the USP 45. Just wondered if anyone had seen them for the .45. Not if they think its a good idea to test different parts in my pistol, safety aside.

 

[Apollo11]

The pistol has already been "tinkered with" by replacing the wonderful stock sights with Heinie Straight Eights, getting a light LEM without the safety/decocker, re stippling the grip and back straps, and sending to Bruce Grey for trigger and internal work. It's gotten better each time. I know the 1911 platform has been around for a century, but that does not preclude manufacture of variable parts for newer platforms. Wolff sells a variety of spring weights for the USP 45. Just wondered if anyone had seen them for the .45. Not if they think its a good idea to test different parts in my pistol, safety aside.

Good for your pistol. When I say "tinker" I mean doing things like trying to tune around a load, or re-engineer the pistol to be a better mouse trap. The improvements you made are hardly exotic. I would just caution when messing with recoil spring weights as there is a cause and effect relationship between the frame and the slide, and the recoil spring is the variable along with the ammo used. I have seen a few cracked polymer frames as a result from frame battering from a light RSA. 1911's with steel frames take things a better than polymer.

My original point was that HK meant this gun to be a weapon for the JSP project, and that I would not look for different weight RSA's to come from them. Wolff on the other hand, maybe send them an email.

 

[ptechjpjr]

1911's with steel frames take things a better than polymer.
.

I don't think this is accurate info.

 

[Apollo11]

I don't think this is accurate info.

How so? I am coming from highly modified (read as light RSA's for fast slide speed, comps, and other spring changes to tailor to the shooter) steel framed guns that have had well over 100,000 documented rounds through them and just keep going. I have also seen friends with polymer framed guns experience cracking at stress points in the frame from running ammo that is hotter with a light RSA---EDIT:and neglected worn out RSA's.

If you have other info please let me know!

 

[texasgun]

I don't think this is accurate info.

yes it is. steel does not experience the metal fatigue which aluminum does. not to mention polymer (fancy word for plastic) which can also develop fatigue cracks. obviously polymer framed guns are outstanding in terms of weight, production costs and corrosion resistance. but a steel frame will outlast any polymer frame. no question.

 

[ptechjpjr]

How so? I am coming from highly modified (read as light RSA's for fast slide speed, comps, and other spring changes to tailor to the shooter) steel framed guns that have had well over 100,000 documented rounds through them and just keep going. I have also seen friends with polymer framed guns experience cracking at stress points in the frame from running ammo that is hotter with a light RSA---EDIT:and neglected worn out RSA's.

If you have other info please let me know!

Do some searching on this forum on the testing that Todd Green has done with HK pistols

 

[Apollo11]

Do some searching on this forum on the testing that Todd Green has done with HK pistols

Really familiar with Todd's testing. Polymer is still not as tough and resistant to cracking as steel. We are comparing apples to oranges though. Todd's testing was done with normal ammo, and with stock RSA's. He was putting the combat pistols through their normal range of duty; no mods, no excessive slide to frame battering.

The OP is talking about changing weight of the RSA. This is a major change in the long term, if the frame ends up getting it's butt kicked by the slide. In the failures I have seen with polymer, they have stressed and cracked down from the frame rails. Polymer is extremely tough, but it flexes and can break too. Steel 1911's are much tougher in this area and will resist the abuse better than a polymer ______ (insert polymer gun here).

Todd's testing proved that HK's are built for the long haul, and that they are excellent in doing what they are designed for. Todd did his part and maintained the springs, and the HK's did their part. However, in the end; if you look at a 1911 with a steel frame (not a cast steel frame), and compare it to a polymer frame--the polymer frame will take less abuse if you get too hot of a round, and a really weak RSA. And that's what we're talking about here--changing the RSA weight and the potential consequences that may result. The HK engineers put the stock weight RSA in there for a reason. There is no getting around the mechanics and physics of the issue.

 

[ptechjpjr]

Apollo,
I don't want to get into arguments with people on this forum. I hope it is safe to assume that you know that HK has a stainless steel skeleton that the polymer frame is molded over.

Any gun no matter what material it is made out of will take a beating and wear if too light of a Recoil Spring is used. I would still bet my money that my USP 45 would be able to fire more hot rounds than a 1911 would before showing excessive wear.

 

[Dessy]

Topic is getting side tracked on a different thread, I agree with apollo11 because I like him, regardless if hes right or not, he's usually right 99 percent of the time, and is man enough to admit if he made a miss understanding mistake. With that said -

I have a HK45c, V1 and feel no need to change anything about it. It is hands down a marvel in it own right. ok back on topic OP. did you decide on anything?

 

[Apollo11]

Gee thanks, Dessy.

I want to clarify something and I'll let this thread be. I am by no means saying that a polymer framed HK is an inferior product, just saying that they (because of their inherent polymer nature), are not as strong as steel. This is a moot point if you use the gun as intended, and replace the RSA as it becomes worn out (10K-20K depending on the model and ammo used).

The failures I have seen are not HK's, but rather Glocks (one with a worn out RSA, and one with a modified RSA). Both frames split, and the cause was the frame getting beaten by a slide that out weighs it. Not all 1911's are created equal, and the super high round count ones that I have seen take a beating were STI and SVI frames chambered in 40.

ptechjpjr, not trying to start an internet argument at all and I appreciate the points you made. My original intention was to caution the OP about the unintended consequences that sometimes happen when a change is made. However, his gun and his dime; and I hope he achieves his HK45 nirvana with it.

 

[bsafe]

Topic is getting side tracked on a different thread... ok back on topic OP. did you decide on anything?

I am by no means new to guns, especially semi auto pistols. As far as 1911's go I have played around with just about every aspect of function, from magazine springs and followers, flat bottom firing pin stops with different FPS weights to full length guide rods and tungsten guide rod plugs. I've tinkered with the operating systems to get different guns to run a 185 gr bullet with a Power factor of 168 to another that now runs 255 gr .45 Super loads with great reliability. I'm well aware of the battering that a frame can take when changing recoil spring weights.

As far as the HK45 goes IMHO the frame will get battered much worse from an over powered RSA when it slams back into battery due to the rather large polymer shock buff that softens the recoil impulse and frame to slide contact at the back end of the cycle. For the same reason a lighter recoil spring would probably contribute less wear and tear, depending on the round being fired, and the shock buff is a rather inexpensive part to replace.

There are plenty of die hard 1911 fans that will say the platform has been around for a century and is the PERFECT system for a combat pistol AS IS. Don't ever change the pistol or the standard perfect one shot stop 230 gr .45 ACP FMJ. "It's worked for this many soldiers in this many wars for this many years." But there are also plenty of tinkerers. It would have been nice to get an answer to my question, but it appears the die hard "HK is perfect, they know best" attitude has dominated this thread in the absence of a knowledgeable answer to the OP.

As far as my OP, it got lost almost immediately. In fact I can't remember asking a question on any forum that went so far off track so quickly. I'm done with the thread unless someone has pertinent info to contribute. Feel free to carry on the new question without me.

I love the HK 45 and as Todd's test proved it's a great combat pistol out of the box with some minor tweaks. Better, longer reliability than anything else he's driven. And I didn't just read about his test. I tok his AFHF class when he was running that gun. I shoot whatever I'm carrying at least once a week, so I'm not just taking the HK out of the safe to play with the design every so often. I've just never been able to sync the attitude, "This is what you're issued. Take it, use it, don't fvck with it." As the saying goes, "Inquiring minds want to know."

 

[ptechjpjr]

bsafe,

I didn't mean to contribute to the sidetracking of your thread but I felt I needed to chime in on the strength of the HK frames.

I am also a tinkerer. I have a USP 45 that I have a 40 Super conversion barrel for. I run a 20lb recoil spring in this gun and it still flings the brass way way out. Like you stated, with the USP's secondary recoil reduction assembly, I wouldn't put a heavier recoil spring in it anyway for fear of excessive wear when the slide comes back into battery. I have complete confidence that my USP's frame is plenty strong enough.

As far as why no one has answered your original question, I don't know that the info is listed anywhere. If I was trying to find this info out I would call HK and ask Travis.


I also have a Bruce Gray modified P2000 with 40 cal and 357 Sig barrels that is just sweet as hell to shoot.

 

[bsafe]

No problem. I will probably end up calling Travis. He's a great guy and proof HK customer service doesn't suck.