HK 91 how accurate?
1 - 20 of 26 Posts
I have been shooting the H&K 91 since 1977.
For over 23 years I was a LEO SWAT Sniper.
I have also shot in IPSC, Sniper rifle matches, Service Rifle, PALMA, and 1000 yard Any, Any rifle matches.
I have hunted a lot with an H&K 91.
I do not consider a standard H&K 91 to have Sniper Rifle quality accuracy.
I DO consider it to have Semiauto rifle, precision rifle accuracy.
Here are some random thoughts, baised on my actual shooting of the H&K 91.
I have shot deer, pigs and antelope as far as 350 yards with no misses, using a scope of course.
Head shots at 100 yards, no problem.
I have shot hand sized groups at 400 yards many, many times.
With a 3.5 to 10 power Leupold scope, using Federal 168gr match ammo, I have had no problem hitting chest sized targets at 850 yards, as long as the wind is not too squirrely...
You can shoot a 5 round group at 100 yards, then shoot 40 rounds rapid fire, and then shoot another 5 round group, and your point of impact, and group size will be the same as your first 5 round group, ie NO Zero shift.
I do not know of any out of the box ParaMilitary semiauto rifle that will do anywhere near as good as the H&K 91.
So while at 100 yards it is not as accurate as a "Sniper Rifle", once you get past 200 yards, and might need to shoot fast, its advantages start to show themselves.
For over 23 years I was a LEO SWAT Sniper.
I have also shot in IPSC, Sniper rifle matches, Service Rifle, PALMA, and 1000 yard Any, Any rifle matches.
I have hunted a lot with an H&K 91.
I do not consider a standard H&K 91 to have Sniper Rifle quality accuracy.
I DO consider it to have Semiauto rifle, precision rifle accuracy.
Here are some random thoughts, baised on my actual shooting of the H&K 91.
I have shot deer, pigs and antelope as far as 350 yards with no misses, using a scope of course.
Head shots at 100 yards, no problem.
I have shot hand sized groups at 400 yards many, many times.
With a 3.5 to 10 power Leupold scope, using Federal 168gr match ammo, I have had no problem hitting chest sized targets at 850 yards, as long as the wind is not too squirrely...
You can shoot a 5 round group at 100 yards, then shoot 40 rounds rapid fire, and then shoot another 5 round group, and your point of impact, and group size will be the same as your first 5 round group, ie NO Zero shift.
I do not know of any out of the box ParaMilitary semiauto rifle that will do anywhere near as good as the H&K 91.
So while at 100 yards it is not as accurate as a "Sniper Rifle", once you get past 200 yards, and might need to shoot fast, its advantages start to show themselves.
Joined
·
2,545 Posts
It is a .308/7.62 for basic run-of-the-mill hunting it will be as good as any other rifle in this caliber up to around 500m for game size animals. NE450NO2, your assessment is on the mark however I find the M1A superior to the 91 for accuracy to a slight degree.
Joined
·
3,406 Posts
My original HK and my PTR 91 both do 2 MOA with irons or holo sights and a variety of ammo. Neither of them like the 168 grain and heavier bullets, they prefer what the gun was designed for .. close to + or - 150 grains
Joined
·
2,750 Posts
Did an informal pole here years ago and most of the HK91s and half the SR9's were reported to be in the over an inch and under two inch range at 100 yards (the other half of the SR9s were a little under an inch). One of the better "cheep" ammo back then was Federal Red Box American Eagle 147 FMJ, which has worked well for myself. Similar to Blitzkrieg, I have not had that good a luck with Federal Gold Metal Match 168gr nor the USGI 168gr ammo (M118 pre LR). I was getting a good under 2MOA with the four power scope and PSG1 trigger pack, and actually averaged a tiny bit under 1.5 MOA for 3 shot groups with the Federal AE ammo. My two SA M1A's (neither one glassed, one standard weight and one heavy barrel) would not average as good as the HK91 (maybe better on some days and worst on others ... with a 10 power scope) - thus both are gone (in part due to reliability issues that never could be corrected). The one AR10 (not a T) was very close to the HK91 but was from the rough chamber era so the friend I got it from traded a couple years later and made it a SBR.
Some of the HK91 have a rough bore after years of not being cleaned and/or being sear hosts, some of them just need a little TLC to remove years of copper and some of us need a better trigger (this is shooter related more than gun ;-). If you want really little groups would start with a Rem 700 PSS and aftermarket trigger, one of the custom rifles, a Sako TRG or if you have too much lunch money burning a hole in your wallet a nice AI (at this point can start to consider a PSG1 again ;-).
Some of the HK91 have a rough bore after years of not being cleaned and/or being sear hosts, some of them just need a little TLC to remove years of copper and some of us need a better trigger (this is shooter related more than gun ;-). If you want really little groups would start with a Rem 700 PSS and aftermarket trigger, one of the custom rifles, a Sako TRG or if you have too much lunch money burning a hole in your wallet a nice AI (at this point can start to consider a PSG1 again ;-).
Some of the Standard Model Springfield Armory M1-A's from 1991 to 1994 that I have shot, grouped as goods as the H&K 91.
For at least the first 5 shots. Some M1-A's will have a shift in point of impact as more rounds are fired and the barrel/gas system starts to move around/expand as it heats up. I have never seen a 91 shift its zero as it heats up. Remember the barrel is free floating.
The M1-A's seem to like the 168gr Federal Match ammo, much better than 147 gr GI ball. Many times Federal Match will cut group sizes in half.
There seem to be a lot of problems with the new current made M1-A's.
I think it is an unfair comparasion to put a M1 A Match rifle against an out of the box H&K 91.
A lot of people report that their H&K 91's shoot better with 150gr bullets. I have shot some European 147/150 gr ball ammo that shot very good, near Match quality. They shoot my 150gr hunting reloads better than ball, as would be expected. The 91's I have fired with Federal 168 Match ammo shot it pretty good, and they shoot my 165gr hunting bulleted ammo real good as well.
I have never seen an original German H&K 91 come out of the box and not shoot good and be 100% reliable.
I have seen a lot of 91's shot since 1977, as back then a lot of my buddies were shooting them in our "combat rifle matches".
For at least the first 5 shots. Some M1-A's will have a shift in point of impact as more rounds are fired and the barrel/gas system starts to move around/expand as it heats up. I have never seen a 91 shift its zero as it heats up. Remember the barrel is free floating.
The M1-A's seem to like the 168gr Federal Match ammo, much better than 147 gr GI ball. Many times Federal Match will cut group sizes in half.
There seem to be a lot of problems with the new current made M1-A's.
I think it is an unfair comparasion to put a M1 A Match rifle against an out of the box H&K 91.
A lot of people report that their H&K 91's shoot better with 150gr bullets. I have shot some European 147/150 gr ball ammo that shot very good, near Match quality. They shoot my 150gr hunting reloads better than ball, as would be expected. The 91's I have fired with Federal 168 Match ammo shot it pretty good, and they shoot my 165gr hunting bulleted ammo real good as well.
I have never seen an original German H&K 91 come out of the box and not shoot good and be 100% reliable.
I have seen a lot of 91's shot since 1977, as back then a lot of my buddies were shooting them in our "combat rifle matches".
Joined
·
2,750 Posts
Photos of groups are always good ... if you don't have videos ;-)
Joined
·
2,463 Posts
JLD91k with an 8 groove TC barrel with iron sights at 100yrds.This is a 5" stick on off a sandbag with some portugese,13 rounds fired with some 2 shot groups under an inch.Not great,but its not a REAL hk91 or is it better. NO spread at all with these heavier profile barrels
![]()
I was moderately impressed with my group sizes. I wouldn't say they were excellent, about 2.5MOA with some surplus NATO rounds and the Hensoldt scope. I was expecting slightly better accuracy given the lack of an actual piston but my 91's fit that DMR role so they'll stay. I feel more confident with an HK set up than just about any other .308 type rifle. They are what they are.
Joined
·
195 Posts
If it quits raining I'm taking my 91 and my PTR G.I. to the range in the morning with some junk ammo cause my cases from Aim's will not be here till Monday. I think it'll do alot better than the average posted, but I'll be at a 100 yd indoor range with no wind and a lead sled from the bench-------I know that's cheating but I want to see what the rifle will do under "Laboratory" conditions. Ken
Joined
·
195 Posts
Here's a group shot today from my HK-91. I fire-lapped it, Bill Springfield trigger,PTR brake,MSG-90 heavy buffer, cheek riser,B&T low profile mount, lapped Burris Extreme Tactical rings, Burris Ballistic PlexLRS 3-9x group shot on 9x in a lead sled at a 100 yd indoor range. I'll go back and see if I have a old pic of the rifle too.
![]()
![]()
Joined
·
195 Posts
It will shoot better than I could see. The only target that I took a pic of was one of the first 2-PTRs that would not feed surplus well, it was a 16" that I fire-lapped and set up like these. I shot a 10 shot open sight group off the HK bipod and elbows and a A3 collapsable stock off the bench. OK I was pretty proud of it. The 91 shot this well with open sights, I just did not save the target.
![]()
Joined
·
2,750 Posts
What type ammo / loading?Here's a group shot today from my HK-91. I fire-lapped it, Bill Springfield trigger,PTR brake,MSG-90 heavy buffer, cheek riser,B&T low profile mount, lapped Burris Extreme Tactical rings, Burris Ballistic PlexLRS 3-9x group shot on 9x in a lead sled at a 100 yd indoor range. I'll go back and see if I have a old pic of the rifle too.![]()
![]()
Not bad, but you now have a rifle which you can never trade off, as very good chance you will never get another one that good (the PTR has promise though ;-).
Joined
·
3,406 Posts
You're a better man than me, Gunga Din. 2 MOA ios the best I get with irons and my HK91 and PTR
1 - 20 of 26 Posts
