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There are actually two different C's in that Firearms blog post. One has the prototype upper. The other has the production version. Both appear to lack adjustable gas blocks. The Grey Room one is a B date code, are you suggesting that HK maintained production of C's into the B date codes?

To be clear, the only thing I am questioning here is if those C that were initially produced and sold (like Malaysia and one other contract), came with adjustable gas blocks.
There is only one 416C in that firearm blog post. That’s the same prototype 416C, there’s a photo of a 10.4” 416 but that’s not a C obviously.

Yes, the production 416C’s were BB and BC date coded. Every single one of them had adjustable gas blocks - England, Philippines, Malaysia, etc. - there are a couple more contracts that were filled.

I’ll post more pictures later - but here’s an English production 416C with the same adjustable gas block that came on the rest of them. Most of them had sling loops and no bayonet lugs.

 

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Here’s a few different ones from the Philippines PSG (Presidential Security Group - AKA - Secret Service). BC date coded with serial #s 171-000250 +, adjustable gas blocks, etc. Some factory 416C’s had the buffer retainer hole and roll pin hole, some did not.



















 

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Thanks for posting those 416C pics, wow, sexy.

Interesting, they use the same piston as the G36C/K. Makes sense. Very cool.

Zib Militaria (German gun parts store) has a bunch of HK 416C parts. So they did have some production of course, not sure of the years.
 

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Discussion Starter #28 (Edited)
@UMP45ENTRY or any of yous guys with the knowledge

My next question is why were they not fielded in any significant way other than those you mention? What was their demise?
 

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@UMP45ENTRY or any of yous guys with the knowledge

My next question is why were they not fielded in any significant way other than those you mention? What was their demise?
It’s been about 8 years now since they stopped production of the C, but from what I remember - HK wasn’t happy with the reliability of the flat wire recoil system. A couple PSG members that I talked to said they shoot them on auto all the time (I have some videos) and have never experienced any malfunctions. I have a few factory C stocks, etc and I’ve never experienced any stoppages myself, either. The flat wire recoil spring doesn’t feel as smooth cycling as a regular coil spring, so maybe there’s some extra drag or resistance against the inside of the shortened receiver extension.
 

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Discussion Starter #30 (Edited)
Interesting....I understand they are piston driven versus DI but there are several PDW style stock systems both with and with out proprietary BCGs, springs and buffers that run flawlessly. I just dont get HK being unhappy but end users not so they stop production. I mean I dont doubt your knowledge at all I am just confused why HK does what they do sometimes. Is it possible that they didnt get as many sales interest as they felt would validate the production as well?

Also what height is the fold down front sight on the C?
 

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Interesting....I understand they are piston driven versus DI but there are several PDW style stock systems both with and with out proprietary BCGs, springs and buffers that run flawlessly. I just dont get HK being unhappy but end users not so they stop production. I mean I dont doubt your knowledge at all I am just confused why HK does what they do sometimes. Is it possible that they didnt get as many sales interest as they felt would validate the production as well?

Also what height is the fold down front sight on the C?
I forget what I read from Jim Schatz (G3Kurz) at the time or what he said to me at the Gray Room in VA, but as an example - if a standard HK416 did an endurance test and had 3 stoppages in 20,000 rounds, and the HK416C variant had 6 stoppages in 20,000 rounds, that may be unacceptable to them. I made up those #’s, but that is how it was described to me.

The 416C came with 33mm flip up front and rear sights. I’ve seen them with both the open and closed 33mm flip up front, I have the closed model on my C build.
 

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A couple more close ups of one of the Philippines PSG 416C’s. A lot of people have not seen how the C stock strut support eyelets are attached to the lower receiver. There are 2 vertically driven roll pins that secure the eyelets to the lower receiver, and a slight notch machined into the lower receiver that prevents the eyelet from rotating when the roll pin is installed. You can also see that this BC date coded HK416C still has the buffer retainer holes present even though it is not required, and some other models came out before and after with the buffer retainer holes eliminated.











 

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Discussion Starter #33
I can understand and relate to them having a set standard and if it doesn't meet it, it becomes a no go. I would assume the end user market was too small when matched with no gos in trials it was a realization by HK that trying to work the kinks out was not as easy as just scrapping the system. Thanks for the sight info....now I just gotta find one thats complete with mounting hardware for my build.
 

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I ran my personal 10.4" HK416 on a C setup on a MR lower without a single issue. I ran it suppressed and non suppressed and never had an issue. I had a 10" adjustable block on it.

I built a 9"C upper with Marvin's barrel with all HK parts and haven't had a single issue on it as well. Again I ran it suppressed and non suppressed without issue. I also had a 10" adjustable block on this as well.

I'd still run this as my duty rifle if I didn't receive one from my department. It's completely reliable and show all types of 223 556 through it without a single issue. I wonder what HK's reliability threshold is



Interesting....I understand they are piston driven versus DI but there are several PDW style stock systems both with and with out proprietary BCGs, springs and buffers that run flawlessly. I just dont get HK being unhappy but end users not so they stop production. I mean I dont doubt your knowledge at all I am just confused why HK does what they do sometimes. Is it possible that they didnt get as many sales interest as they felt would validate the production as well?

Also what height is the fold down front sight on the C?
I forget what I read from Jim Schatz (G3Kurz) at the time or what he said to me at the Gray Room in VA, but as an example - if a standard HK416 did an endurance test and had 3 stoppages in 20,000 rounds, and the HK416C variant had 6 stoppages in 20,000 rounds, that may be unacceptable to them. I made up those #’s, but that is how it was described to me.

The 416C came with 33mm flip up front and rear sights. I’ve seen them with both the open and closed 33mm flip up front, I have the closed model on my C build.
 

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Discussion Starter #36
I ran my personal 10.4" HK416 on a C setup on a MR lower without a single issue. I ran it suppressed and non suppressed and never had an issue. I had a 10" adjustable block on it.

I built a 9"C upper with Marvin's barrel with all HK parts and haven't had a single issue on it as well. Again I ran it suppressed and non suppressed without issue. I also had a 10" adjustable block on this as well.

I'd still run this as my duty rifle if I didn't receive one from my department. It's completely reliable and show all types of 223 556 through it without a single issue. I wonder what HK's reliability threshold is



Interesting....I understand they are piston driven versus DI but there are several PDW style stock systems both with and with out proprietary BCGs, springs and buffers that run flawlessly. I just dont get HK being unhappy but end users not so they stop production. I mean I dont doubt your knowledge at all I am just confused why HK does what they do sometimes. Is it possible that they didnt get as many sales interest as they felt would validate the production as well?

Also what height is the fold down front sight on the C?
I forget what I read from Jim Schatz (G3Kurz) at the time or what he said to me at the Gray Room in VA, but as an example - if a standard HK416 did an endurance test and had 3 stoppages in 20,000 rounds, and the HK416C variant had 6 stoppages in 20,000 rounds, that may be unacceptable to them. I made up those #’s, but that is how it was described to me.

The 416C came with 33mm flip up front and rear sights. I’ve seen them with both the open and closed 33mm flip up front, I have the closed model on my C build.
My issue is this is a 9 inch 300BO barrel I want to do in a C variant. Marvin made the bbl, but all of the testing was done with a standard buffer tube with a AR carbine spring and the regular HK buffer but the gas system has to be the PDW length. So with that in mind I have to stick to that set up. Marvin is still trying to workout a few bugs on the 300bbl and I am thinking it will probably end up being a 10 inch or longer offering.
 

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Wow! One of the best and fastest post count threads in my memory. Really good stuff here!

UMP45 ENTRY is definitely the resident expert on C models and has helped me offline in my quest to finish mine. I need a 33mm solid loop front flip sight and to finish my AGB (needs engraved or etched with the “N”, machine off bayonet lug and refinish). Seeing these photos, some for the first time, is very inspiring.

What is the story with as issued flash hiders? Were there multiple offered or only seen with one? Any info on manufacturer?

Thanks!

TC
 
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