HKPRO Forums banner

1 - 12 of 12 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
119 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Hello, I'm pretty new to HK's and Class III guns although I've been shooting all my life.

I recently bought a registered receiver MP5, w/ a push pin lower. It was made pre-1986.

http://www.westernfirearms.com/wfc/hkmp5?set=48

Apparently this is somewhat of a rare setup. I did some searches here and it seems 90% or more of the people here have a sear gun or talk about a sear gun.

Now from what I understand a sear can be moved from gun to gun.

I would think a registered receiver gun would be preferred because most everything can be bought new and replaced (like from HKparts.net)

What is the difference between a push pin gun and a non push pin gun. Is one not able to replace the trigger pack at all or is it harder ??
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
303 Posts
You should post this in NFA talk.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,294 Posts
From a purest standpoint, the order of desirability is:

1. Factory original gun (very, very few transferable HKs exist)

2. Converted push-pin (most closely resembles factory gun)

3. a) sear, b) clip-on

From the standpoint that these things cost an arm and a leg, the sear offers the greatest flexibility since it can be moved from gun to gun. The sear is the best way to go if you can only buy one machine gun. If you can afford to buy a half dozen or more machine guns, then the push-pin may be the way to go, and even the clip-on is an excellent value. If you can afford an original factory transferable, then I want to be your friend.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,025 Posts
I purchased my MP5N from Western Firearms. Extreamly happy with what I received and the owner Nick is trustworthy.

He has many more MP5 models in his inventory so what you see is only what he has posted. Before all the guns were sold, the "clipped and pinned" models were selling for $19,500.

Your looking at the rare push pin lowers that are much more expensive. The diffference is that the trigger pack has a real push pin and not a fake one. The gun also has a hole instead of a ledge.

You can use the real push pin trigger pack on other machine guns but because the gun has the real pin hole it is in itself deemed a machinegun even wthout the trigger pack. Often times the gun and trigger pack are married and cannot be separated.

The rare receiver is a REAL version and not a modified HK94 that has been turned into the MP5 and restamped.

http://www.remtek.com/arms/hk/civ/94/94.htm

They are basically the same thing after the conversion... just born differently.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
28 Posts
I prefer RegRec Push-Pins

I've owned both sear guns and RRPP's. I think the RRPP is the way to go.
Admittedly i'm somewhat of a purist, but looking into my sear pack at the collection of "franken-parts" drove me crazy (most / ?all? sears need to be fitted into the pack and this requires other parts to be modified / "tuned").

It functioned fine, but I realized that if a part or spring broke I couldn't simply pop in a replacement as I could with a factory lower - rather I would have to send it out to an HK savy smith to figure it out.

Enjoy
Charles
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
8,632 Posts
I've owned both sear guns and RRPP's. I think the RRPP is the way to go.
Admittedly i'm somewhat of a purist, but looking into my sear pack at the collection of "franken-parts" drove me crazy (most / ?all? sears need to be fitted into the pack and this requires other parts to be modified / "tuned").

It functioned fine, but I realized that if a part or spring broke I couldn't simply pop in a replacement as I could with a factory lower - rather I would have to send it out to an HK savy smith to figure it out.

Enjoy
Charles
That's mostly right. There are only two parts modified for most of the common H-type catches - the hole location for the catch pivot point, and just sometimes (like burst packs, for instance) the hammer needs an extra tab welded on to it. In other packs, the notch for the hammer simply needs to be cut a little deeper. There are packs with registered catches that have tens of thousands of rounds through them with no breakages.

You can't "break" a hole, and the springs are all factory springs, sometimes from a semi-auto version pack. I suppose you could break the hammer, but it's not likely.

Being able to use all factory (I.E. cheap) parts would be a great thing, and don't get me wrong, I'd love a RRPP too, but I sure do love the flexibility of being able to move my sear into any host I want, so I can shoot .223, .308, 9mm, .40, or 10mm as the case may be, all in full-auto.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
8,632 Posts
I purchased my MP5N from Western Firearms. Extreamly happy with what I received and the owner Nick is trustworthy.

He has many more MP5 models in his inventory so what you see is only what he has posted. Before all the guns were sold, the "clipped and pinned" models were selling for $19,500.

Your looking at the rare push pin lowers that are much more expensive. The diffference is that the trigger pack has a real push pin and not a fake one. The gun also has a hole instead of a ledge.

You can use the real push pin trigger pack on other machine guns but because the gun has the real pin hole it is in itself deemed a machinegun even wthout the trigger pack. Often times the gun and trigger pack are married and cannot be separated.

The rare receiver is a REAL version and not a modified HK94 that has been turned into the MP5 and restamped.

http://www.remtek.com/arms/hk/civ/94/94.htm

They are basically the same thing after the conversion... just born differently.
Even if the pack and receiver are not married, you cannot move a pushpin pack to any other weapon, unless of course THAT one is also a registered receiver push-pin host. And of course, if you modify the pack so it will fit a non-pushpin receiver, you have completed step one on the way to Club Fed.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,016 Posts
I suppose you could break the hammer, but it's not likely.
I have broken a hammer before.Well it was actually JDP7,but it was my pack,so I wont steal the glory.Yes it was a factory hammer.Ordered another from a guy on Sturm and runs like new again.
The real question is if you want other host guns.Thats basically what it comes down to.The real swing down lower is nice in that you can change up styles etc very easy.But in the long run either can be fixed just as easy by someone with the appropriate knowledge.
"Back in the day", the RRPP was the way to go.I guess before the clones hit the market.Like it or not Todd at SW is the person that created the clone market and I guess we can thank him for the sear prices,thats a whole other thread though.The RRPP was as close to factory as you could get.Honestly,the sear conversion was more work than just drill a hole and register the reciever.I have been told that HK parts were scarce in the early days and thats why the sears were created.Truth or fiction?The clip on guns were made to save another $200 stamp for a SBR back when the guns were only hundreds to begin with.Why they just didnt register the sear and marry the two is beyond me.Maybe just more headache?You gotta remember this was back in the late 70 early 80s when all this was going on.No parts kits and parts like it is now.They were selling the whole guns new then for what clones are now-or less.
The clip on guns function the exact same as the sear guns,except the trip is the sear in most cases, and the pack could in theory fit a clone gun or what have you.I think that the clip on pack guns are overlooked in respect to sear guns along with RRPPs.You just dont have that flexibility.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
302 Posts
I broke a hammer too. First time shooting a full auto MP5, didn't even get through the first mag. Wasn't my gun either, owner said he had done it before too.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,016 Posts
Mine broke in half.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
36 Posts
Push Pin Guns

Sounds like a nice gun... I too favor RRPP guns over either sear guns or RR clip-on guns. Once you have an H&K sear or two in your collection (ideally, one in a burst pack and one in a SEF pack) the novelty of moving them around to different host guns wore off for me. Sure, you could run them with the cheaper clone guns to save on the wear and tear on your real H&K guns, but most of these guns can be fired for many years w/o breaking parts or wearing out something important. These are stamped steel combat guns and they can be refinished and repaired to like new if needed after use w/o reducing their value (unless the repair/refinish was not done correctly). My first H&K was a sear gun, but after that I collected mostly RRPP guns because I prefer the more original look, factory parts swap and just knowing I am that much closer to the real thing. The same is true when I have guns built. For example: H&K 53 builds always use a new or as new Post 53 gun for parts and a 93 receiver as the host. This costs more to build than just cutting up the 93 to function like a 53, but to me, it is just not as nice a result (carrier cut, recoil rod often customized, single wall cocking tube...).

Transferable RRPP guns are worth more to me (and most collectors) and I have never sold one where I did not get a premium price over a sear gun (usually a few thousand dollars more). Buy whichever satisfies you and your wallet. All of them are great guns to have and shoot!

Oh, I have never broken a hammer in any of my guns. Only roller retaining plates have gone and these are maintenance items.
 
1 - 12 of 12 Posts
Top