[pb_removed]

New Build Concept: MSG3K *Update 11/27/12

I've decided to chronicle my upcoming build from start to finish.

BACKGROUND:
Much of my inspiration has come from this particular G3 variant:

I also looked at the MSG3 (rare) to help me fill in some of the blanks.

STATUS:

Currently, after talking a few of the finer details over with Mike at TSC, I am currently in the collecting phase. Here is a teaser pic of a few of the harder-to-find items that are really going to make this build something special:

The S&B scope is a pretty rare bird here in the states and I have only ever seen one other and it is on an LMT MWS in Virginia. It is a 1.5-6x20mm P3 Mil Dot w/Flash dot.

 

[johfu]

...thats going to be bad a$$...

 

[tmbrwulf]

That is going to be awesome. I need to hurry and finish my K. I'll be looking to forward to seeing your build. good luck

 

[forFREEDOM]

Oh man, Point, I'm subscribing to this one. I smell awesomeness brewing.

 

[JTinIN]

Why the 1.5x6 vs the lower power model?

Assuming to get a little more range and don't need the the last bit of field of view at the low end?

 

[SDduc996]

Damn bro. That's gonna be a sweet build. I love S&B Flash Dots. First time I saw one was while deployed to Germany. The MWR owner had a 16" 6.8SPC for Pigs that had a 1-4. Man the clarity was amazing. I've wanted one since. He had one that had a HUGE ding in the tube at the objective he was going to sell me for $1400. The ding made me not buy it. I've kept wondering if I should have. Oh, it turns out they're no cheaper in Germany either.

Good luck and I'm definitely keeping an eye out for this.

 

[MOAxp]

Good choice for a build

The 1.5-6 worked fine with the one I had built. It is in the members gallery and given the accuracy I was not limited by magnification Only difference now mine runs with a msg90 buttstock. I have the other builds done and will post a few pics of those (psk1-k/sd and msg90lwt)

 

[SDduc996]

I'm not gonna lie, I keep looking at that bad boy and want one! For some reason that PSG1 stock looks awesome on that K.

 

[pb_removed]

Why the 1.5x6 vs the lower power model?

Assuming to get a little more range and don't need the the last bit of field of view at the low end?

There really isn't a major loss of FOV at top end magnification (3m or so). One can always back out to 4x if need be. I also don't run my 1.1-4x's much below 1.5x anyway since 1.1x makes things appear almost farther away than actual. Also my 1.1-4x Short dots are occupied: http://www.hkpro.com/forum/hkpro-members-gallery/152608-hk-5-56-goodness.html. And since the S&B price increase, I got the 1.5-6x for about HALF of what the 1-8x will cost (if it ever comes out) and more than $1k less than what a new 1.1-4x would cost me with LE discount.

 

[JTinIN]

There really isn't a major loss of FOV at top end magnification (3m or so). One can always back out to 4x if need be. I also don't run my 1.1-4x's much below 1.5x anyway since 1.1x makes things appear almost farther away than actual. Also my 1.1-4x Short dots are occupied: http://www.hkpro.com/forum/hkpro-members-gallery/152608-hk-5-56-goodness.html. And since the S&B price increase, I got the 1.5-6x for about HALF of what the 1-8x will cost (if it ever comes out) and more than $1k less than what a new 1.1-4x would cost me with LE discount.

Thanks was looking at the 1.1-4 Short dot for the MM23eK at one time (thinking will stick with the classic red dot for now) and appreciate the back ground on your reasons. Sounds like a nice rifle and probably the best "if I only had one long gun", as that will ever bet the case for most of us ;-).

Take care and looking forward to seeing the build, groups and if you are going to suppress this one.

 

[pb_removed]

Thanks was looking at the 1.1-4 Short dot for the MM23eK at one time (thinking will stick with the classic red dot for now) and appreciate the back ground on your reasons. Sounds like a nice rifle and probably the best "if I only had one long gun", as that will ever bet the case for most of us ;-).

Take care and looking forward to seeing the build, groups and if you are going to suppress this one.

A Short Dot would be an excellent choice. I've just gotten really lucky on mine. My most expensive one to date didn't cost me $2k, and with the exception of the #2 (post style reticle) and the not-yet released 1-8x, I've used every Short Dot variant. I love 'em all to be honest. Aimpoints and Short dots are now the only optics I employ on my carbines.

You're pretty close on the "if I had only one gun idea". I dabble in the long-range precision stuff, but I have a soft spot for DMR's. I had recently purchased a KAC EMC (write-up in Range Report). The EMC is a darn fine rifle, and I like the concept. As I have written, it can do just about anything from 0-600m. The issue is that it doesn't do any of those jobs overly well. My relationship with KAC products is like a bad high-school romance. I love them for something they do one minute and hate them the next...and repeat the process over again a week/month/year later. Basically, I wanted to put the theory of the EMC into a bomb-proof platform (G3/G3k). In addition to the high-quality German craftsmanship and parts, the spare parts lot for keeping a G3/91 gun running are relatively inexpensive . Mags are a whopping $3 (of which I have dozens) vs. the $100 price tag for a OEM SR25 magazine.

I would love to have it suppressed, but since I am your neighbor to the West, it won't likely happen. Heck, it's only been 5 days since the bill was signed to let Tac/SWAT teams use suppressors.

 

[jetnspector]

I'm subscribing to this one too; don't let us down!

 

[pb_removed]

I'm subscribing to this one too; don't let us down!

No worries. I have a few more parts inbound early this week. I will have an update shortly after

 

[1_ar_newbie]

No worries. I have a few more parts inbound early this week. I will have an update shortly after

G3k barrel?

 

[G3Kurz]

This should be a very rewarding exercise 4445. Some of the very best performing HK's were the short-barreled G3K and HK417 assaulter. Some laugh at a 7.62mm rifle with less than 16" of tube but they would not be laughing on the receiving end. I find these K beasts all around excellent performers - portable, reliable and accurate and the G3/HK91 platform offers MANY modular variants in stocks, forearms and triggers - a "LEGO" gun you can reconfigure w/o tools for unlimited roles. My demo G3K was a sub-MOA gun even after MANY full auto 20-rd and 50-rd drum engagements well above 10,000 rds. I especially like your plans for the MSG90/HK21E QD scope mount. Such a platform deserves the PGS1 or G3 SG1 trigger of course.

I know an MR762A1 that is getting the same "treatment".

Good luck.
G3Kurz

 

[U.S. Praetorian]

This should be a very rewarding exercise 4445. Some of the very best performing HK's were the short-barreled G3K and HK417 assaulter. Some laugh at a 7.62mm rifle with less than 16" of tube but they would not be laughing on the receiving end. I find these K beasts all around excellent performers - portable, reliable and accurate and the G3/HK91 platform offers MANY modular variants in stocks, forearms and triggers - a "LEGO" gun you can reconfigure w/o tools for unlimited roles. My demo G3K was a sub-MOA gun even after MANY full auto 20-rd and 50-rd drum engagements well above 10,000 rds.

I explored this extensively when wanting a K model, as in G3K. I was concerned with accuracy at range because I looked at the 51 platform as well and concluded the following:
HK never went below 12.4 inches on a 7.62x51 barrel and I surmise that even though the HK G3K has a 1:9 ROT (I believe) the loss of MV put the 7.62x51 projectile, 147 gr. at or below that of the 7.62x39 in a 16 inch barrel and was a redundancy in a barrel less than 12.4 inches. Accuracy can still be sub-MOA and in the G3K barrel still exceeds the AK round. Thusly, I went with this over the 51. This speculation on my part and I know RCM makes 1:7 twist 51 barrels which I am sure will be quite accurate at range 250-350M as some will attest but the G3K uses the standard carrier and recoil rod and is a little more controllable than the 51. I may still @ some point pick up a 51 because I like the compactness for carry but as they say, "indecision is a bi*ch"!

 

[pb_removed]

G3k barrel?

Actually, no. I considered using an aftermarket MSG90 barrel, Mike suggested a 21 or 21e barrel to "keep it German" (as he likes to do). Ultimately, we thought the SR9 barrel might be an interesting way to go as it offers a slightly heavier profile and polygonal rifling, but still wouldn't be adding an unnecessary amount of weight. I had picked up an excellently priced SR9 in great condition to use for parts. Fortunately a fellow Pro member was selling a brand new SR9 barrel in the white (Thanks, Corey) and it should be showing up on my doorstep tomorrow or Wednesday. That SR9 will most likely be making an appearance in the for sale section for anyone interested.

Since I do not intend to make this an SBR (as I can't here in IL), the barrel will not be the true G3K 12.5" barrel length. It will probably be somewhere around 14" in length with a permanent flash hider. I have NO intention of using one of those awful four-prong monstrosities. I would have liked to used one of those long G28 flash hiders, but we all know acquiring one of those probably isn't a reasonable task. I decided to make up some of the length by either using a longer flash hider, one that covers the barrel or both. Surefire's 417 flash hider offering was appealing, but I think I might take a different approach:

The SR9 barrel profile is only slightly thicker than that of an M14 barrel. The Surefire M14 flash hider adds about 2 inches of length to a weapon AND covers about an inch of barrel. Hopefully, we can get the right balance of attaining the necessary length and keep a little extra muzzle velocity without sacrificing any style/appearance in the process.

 

[MOAxp]

I especially like your plans for the MSG90/HK21E QD scope mount. Such a platform deserves the PGS1 or G3 SG1 trigger of course.

G3Kurz

Built right - they flat out shoot

Did it shoot… @ 100yards with LC84 M118SB it did ‘alright’ and dropped 10 into a decent group. But don’t tell it that it is only a 12.3” bbl

Rear sight is on - standard G3 and running with MSG90A1 stock. Gun is a hammer. http://www.hkpro.com/forum/hkpro-members-gallery/142358-moaxps-g3k-cqb-dmr.html
Link details what I had done etc.

 

[pb_removed]

I see you chose the ARMs STANAG rings. How have they worked for you thus far?

 

[MOAxp]

For the simple fact I had 4 sets and no EGW - HK the ARMS rings work well. I have to post my PSG1 carbine up - I used same mount and ring combo on that one too. But a ZF 84 10x optic instead