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I've been pondering for a few months on another HK. I've got the HK45 and P30S V3 DA/SA. I'm figuring I should pick up a P30L, but am debating on whether I should get a P30LS V3 to match my P30 and HK45 or a Light LEM version. What do you all think? Should I stick to the trend I've established, or go for some slight variety? Looking for the experts to give me some sound advice!
 

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Consistent works. But why be consistent with an at best second tier trigger system like DA/SA?

My recommendation is to NOT buy another pistol for now.

Spend the $75 and convert your HK45 to Light LEM without any redundant levers. An hour of time bonding with your pistol at your kitchen table. Be sure it's Light LEM. Standard LEM is like 9-pound DA all the time. It'll be inconsistent with your P30 of course. Learn the LEM trigger system over a couple of weeks or months. Note it is not a "pull thru" DA trigger, you take the slack out coming up to line of sight and complete the trigger press when the sights align. (Same way you should be shooting your P30 in DA mode.) Trigger reset works just like it does in DA/SA.

Like many of us you may discard HK DA/SA completely. Some claim to prefer DA/SA over Light LEM but I suspect many of those haven't given Light LEM a fair (or any) trial. (I'm also informed that there are folks who prefer Lite Beer(!) :wink: but I doubt they've tied craft beer -- yeah, it ain't $6 a 12-pack.)

Anyway it's your choice. But make it after some personal study and experience. A good three-day pistol course with a Light LEM pistol should convince you. Either way.

-- Chuck
 

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Chuck,

I have the HK45 SA/DA system. If you carry and shoot the HK45 like you would a 1911 (carrying cocked and locked and shooting SA only), what do you gain by the LEM transition? I've never even fired my HK45 in the DA mode. Why is this NOT a better system than the LEM?
 

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Chuck,

I have the HK45 SA/DA system. If you carry and shoot the HK45 like you would a 1911 (carrying cocked and locked and shooting SA only), what do you gain by the LEM transition? I've never even fired my HK45 in the DA mode. Why is this NOT a better system than the LEM?
Not having a manual safety without a traditional DA pull.

I was ready to give up on HK after selling my P30s v3. I am not a fan of traditional DA/SA and liked the ability to carry condition 1 with the P30s, but eventually found the safety unworkable for me. Trying a P30 v2 made me fall in love with the gun all over. Everything I loved about the P30 with the negatives deleted. Now that I've swapped springs to make it a vTGS I'm even more enamored.

Some people just don't like the manual safeties on HKs. The OP may not be one of them, but I sure am.
 

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I am by no means an expert... Have you ever shot the LEM variant? I'm completely sold on the LEM trigger system and have decided any future HK's will be LEM. Everybody is different...
 

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Consistent works. But why be consistent with an at best second tier trigger system like DA/SA?

My recommendation is to NOT buy another pistol for now.

Spend the $75 and convert your HK45 to Light LEM without any redundant levers. An hour of time bonding with your pistol at your kitchen table. Be sure it's Light LEM
I agree -- I did this myself and even though I was a DA/SA fan, I like the (light) LEM much much more. Consistent light trigger pull with a nice break and reset -- what is not to like? I also feel it is a safer mechanism than DA/SA carried cocked and locked and I see it as an improvement over that (just my opinion).

In contrast to many others I kept the safety lever (with a 5+6 detent plate that prevents decock) on my LEM. Two reasons:
1) I am used to always disengaging the safety (from the 1911 platform) and it is natural to me to also shoot the gun resting my thumb on the safety (and that why you should disable the decock function of the lever with the new detent plate)
2) I like the extra layer of safety for a carry gun -- especially when handling the gun for cleaning for example. This is my personal feeling though, and I agree it is not strictly necessary -- especially since one can keep your thumb on the hammer when reholstering -- that is also the reason why I think LEM is a big improvement over striker fired pistols like the Glock.

All in all, I think the an HK with LEM is one of the best and safest trigger systems out there. Brilliant engineering from HK.
 

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Note it is not a "pull thru" DA trigger, you take the slack out coming up to line of sight and complete the trigger press when the sights align. (Same way you should be shooting your P30 in DA mode.)
I guess Todd L Green and Ernest Langdon haven't a clue what they're talking about, eh?
 

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I guess Todd L Green and Ernest Langdon haven't a clue what they're talking about, eh?
Not a damn clue :wink:. I only "stage" my L LEM if I have a long shot on a small target, otherwise I pull it right through. I also find it better not to over think the LEM, once you get comfortable with it.
 

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Chuck,

I have the HK45 SA/DA system. If you carry and shoot the HK45 like you would a 1911 (carrying cocked and locked and shooting SA only), what do you gain by the LEM transition? I've never even fired my HK45 in the DA mode. Why is this NOT a better system than the LEM?
I hate using quotes but the response was directed to me.

The HK45 DA/SA system can indeed be carried cocked and locked. I believe this system is licensed by HK from Taurus who has used it for decades in their M92 model originally produced for the Brazilian Army and which they acquired from Beretta!. The HK frame safety does not, at least for me, mimic the M1911 safety well enough for this style carry. Long time M1911 shooters who've taken professional training know their thumb must be on top of the M1911 safety lever at all times. Same applies to any SA pistol with a frame safety. No swiping off and tucking underneath. A few folks have reported decocking their HK riding the safety.

I vainly put myself in the kinda-well trained M1911 category and my thumb instinctively rides the lever as I grip the pistol in the holster. Since that didn't work for me with HK pistols I tried LEM and discovered the simplicity of the no-lever design.

I'll select a good M1911 over the HK-V1 cocked and locked every day. Or any DA/SA pistol.

A good M1911 vs. my HK45C-LEM is a closer contest and I carry one of the other system exclusively.

DA/SA with the complication of a safety is a third tier trigger at best. Ya gotta move the safety to Fire every time you grab the pistol even if you never put it on Safe. Mr. Murphy will have safed it when you least expected it. Ya gotta un-safe it. Every time. M1911 shooters do this automatically without thinking.

Convert your HK45 to Light LEM. Less than an hour of your time including a detailed cleaning of the pistol in places you never looked. A couple of months and preferably a good 3-day basic tactical pistol course and you'll know. That same hour's effort will degrade -- er, reconvert -- it to V1 again if desired. If you want DA/SA use the V3 detent plate. Eliminates the safety and cocked and locked-- and Mr. Murphy's efforts to disable the pistol.

-- Chuck
 

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Once you go LEM you will most likely start spending money getting kits to upgrade all your other HK's for LEM too. Trust me.
 

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I have the same question. I have a 45c and P30s in DA/SA. I tried to rent a Lem at the range with no luck- none available. So, instead of wondering what it is like, I have a LEM 2000sk on the way.

I considered the idea of converting the 45C, which is a very practical and relatively low cost way to make a decision on the LEM. However, I am thinking the LEM in the SK makes extra sense as it is intended for CCW.

I also do not believe I will desire to have every handgun shoot the same. Although, it may make sense to have a sub-set of them operate equivalently. Once I have experience with the SK/LEM, I'll try to make the decision.
 

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I hate using quotes but the response was directed to me.

The HK45 DA/SA system can indeed be carried cocked and locked. I believe this system is licensed by HK from Taurus who has used it for decades in their M92 model originally produced for the Brazilian Army and which they acquired from Beretta!. The HK frame safety does not, at least for me, mimic the M1911 safety well enough for this style carry. Long time M1911 shooters who've taken professional training know their thumb must be on top of the M1911 safety lever at all times. Same applies to any SA pistol with a frame safety. No swiping off and tucking underneath. A few folks have reported decocking their HK riding the safety.

I vainly put myself in the kinda-well trained M1911 category and my thumb instinctively rides the lever as I grip the pistol in the holster. Since that didn't work for me with HK pistols I tried LEM and discovered the simplicity of the no-lever design.

I'll select a good M1911 over the HK-V1 cocked and locked every day. Or any DA/SA pistol.

A good M1911 vs. my HK45C-LEM is a closer contest and I carry one of the other system exclusively.

DA/SA with the complication of a safety is a third tier trigger at best. Ya gotta move the safety to Fire every time you grab the pistol even if you never put it on Safe. Mr. Murphy will have safed it when you least expected it. Ya gotta un-safe it. Every time. M1911 shooters do this automatically without thinking.

Convert your HK45 to Light LEM. Less than an hour of your time including a detailed cleaning of the pistol in places you never looked. A couple of months and preferably a good 3-day basic tactical pistol course and you'll know. That same hour's effort will degrade -- er, reconvert -- it to V1 again if desired. If you want DA/SA use the V3 detent plate. Eliminates the safety and cocked and locked-- and Mr. Murphy's efforts to disable the pistol.

-- Chuck
I could not have said it better myself. As a long time 1911 user I cannot do anything but keep my thumb over the safety when firing the pistol. When I first got my HK45c I COULD NOT fire the pistol without decocking it every shot. I was already on the fence about going to LEM so this put me over the edge. I installed the light LEM kit and I LOVE IT. I also either carry the 1911 platform cocked and locked or my HK45c in light LEM. I love the LEM and it really does feel more like a good single action trigger then a double action( I know it is a TRUE double action and we should not call it a single action, but that is the best way I can describe it).
 

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I personally prefer the V2 LEM on a CC gun because of the bobbed hammer and consistent trigger pull. I assume you won't be using the P30L in any variant for carry in which case I would think that keeping consistent and going with the configuration you're used to would be the best bet. It's definitely an individual preference either way and will always boil down to what you feel best with. As many others have mentioned, you can always convert to LEM down the road if you decide you like it more.
 

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May have spoken too soon. I know you can convert from DA/SA to LEM in the HK45/c but I'm not sure on the P30 because of the decocker gap. Sorry.
 
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