Old vs. new
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Some parts were changed over the years but the new parts are not inferior. There is little practical reason to purchase a pre-2005 USP over a post-2005 USP unless you want a specific year for your collection. See the threads below.
USP date codes and key changes
I'm looking at a USP .40 tomorrow. I see the date code is two digits, starting with A=0 thru K=9. So AK would be 2009, and BA would be 2010 and KK would be 99, if I understand correctly. With that in mind, I am aware there were some changes to the USP over time. Can anyone summarize those...
www.hkpro.com
What were the changes H&K made to USP over the years?
I found the thread yesterday but forgot to save it. Now I can't find it at all. Someone posted all the changes they did through out the years. Mine is marked AA so it'd be counted as 2000. I want to check and see if my USP has all the upgrades H&K has done to USPs.
www.hkpro.com
A Beginners/Buyers Guide to the HK USP Series of Handguns
A Beginners /Buyers Guide to the H&K USP Series of Handguns I have been a gun owner for many years, but in 2003 I was witness to an armed robbery that made me realize I was in desperate need of a defensive handgun. A reliable defensive handgun. One that I could learn inside and out, and trust...
www.hkpro.com
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I like to have USP DA/SA guns converted to LEM.
When I buy an older USP DA/SA gun and purchase a Hk LEM kit, I get this part as well -
"Please note: That any pre-2005 production USP Variants will also need the new style catch part number 219442" .
hkparts.net
When I buy an older USP DA/SA gun and purchase a Hk LEM kit, I get this part as well -
"Please note: That any pre-2005 production USP Variants will also need the new style catch part number 219442" .
HK Universal LEM Kit Complete - HK45, USP, & USPC - HKPARTS
Universal LEM conversion kit for USP, USPC & HK45, HK45C pistols. This universal LEM kit also fits the recently released HK45C & HK45 pistols.
hkparts.net
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HUGE difference!
The older guns will make you shoot straighter, be better looking, make your wife love you more & your income will increase tenfold.
Wanna buy one??????
Sounds like a must have then!HUGE difference!
The older guns will make you shoot straighter, be better looking, make your wife love you more & your income will increase tenfold.
Wanna buy one??????
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I heard the new USP Compacts use Indian MIM parts. Take with a grain of salt, as I have nothing to substantiate this.
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Then don't share it, this is how BS spreads on the internet.
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Pretty much this.
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Well, where's the fun in that??????????? 😝
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It’s been said all over the internet (including this forum) that HK pistols use MIM parts, so the cats out on that one. But I won’t continue to spread the rumors (except for this post and maybe my next one).
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Hey, you do you. I was just referring to the idea of having no data to substantiate info one is spreading.
As most of us know, MIM does not automatically equal junk.
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I heard they also make you taller. How many do I need to buy to be 6'2" if I'm starting around 6'?HUGE difference!
The older guns will make you shoot straighter, be better looking, make your wife love you more & your income will increase tenfold.
Wanna buy one??????
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651 Posts
I heard they also make you taller. How many do I need to buy to be 6'2" if I'm starting around 6'?
Depends on the model.
Depends on how you stack them before you stand on them...I heard they also make you taller. How many do I need to buy to be 6'2" if I'm starting around 6'?
Its the collectors that are driving this. There are many guns out there that have gone up to stupid levels - witness Colt Pythons. Someone will make a comment about XYZ and than it spreads, true or not.
An example - I see this same disease around many of the S&W models. There seems to be an opinion that the older guns are better made than the newer guns ie. there was no MIM - they were machined bar stock, the parts were hand machined, polished and blued. There is some truth to this of course in regards to the hand finishing. I had a guy tell me that my newer S&W revolver was absolute junk and would never be worth anything ...
An example - I see this same disease around many of the S&W models. There seems to be an opinion that the older guns are better made than the newer guns ie. there was no MIM - they were machined bar stock, the parts were hand machined, polished and blued. There is some truth to this of course in regards to the hand finishing. I had a guy tell me that my newer S&W revolver was absolute junk and would never be worth anything
...There is a difference between older guns that are still currently manufactured (what this post was about) and older and/or out of production guns. If still manufactured, the older guns hold their value pretty well but do not command a premium except as someone said, to a collector looking for a year and that isn’t driving the market. Sometimes it’s the opposite and the newer guns do have incremental improvements. Hand fitting and finishes are no where near a consideration as they are in the revolver market (correct, right or wrong- JM makes a compelling argument that newer ones are improved and he shoots/knows them better than me so...).
As far as the premium on the older out of production guns, they are worth it because that’s what they sell for. The $2k plus sales aren’t outliers...
As far as the premium on the older out of production guns, they are worth it because that’s what they sell for. The $2k plus sales aren’t outliers...
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I had a guy tell me that my newer S&W revolver was absolute junk and would never be worth anything
He may not be wrong............................
Long time S&W owner here. I've got right at 27 Smith wheelguns, so I try to keep up with what's going on there. The lock models have NO collector value whatsoever in today's market. None.
As for "junk", I know they're having LOTS of issues with canted barrels. Specifically, the Model 317. Probably others too.
Personally, I've only bought two lock guns & I've installed the delete kit on both of them.
As for Pythons, their quality is all over the place. When Colt had its UAW trouble in the 1970s, the Python quality was often close to a Hi-Point. I saw stripped screws out of the rear sight plate from the upper frame. Out of time issues, just all sorts of CRAP from what was supposed to be THE best revolver made. The new Pythons don't really have any influence on the older model pricing. Only thing they really have in common is the name. They're two totally differently engineered guns.
You probably both are right... You are fortunate that you can own 27 of them!He may not be wrong............................
Long time S&W owner here. I've got right at 27 Smith wheelguns, so I try to keep up with what's going on there. The lock models have NO collector value whatsoever in today's market. None.
As for "junk", I know they're having LOTS of issues with canted barrels. Specifically, the Model 317. Probably others too.
Personally, I've only bought two lock guns & I've installed the delete kit on both of them.
As for Pythons, their quality is all over the place. When Colt had its UAW trouble in the 1970s, the Python quality was often close to a Hi-Point. I saw stripped screws out of the rear sight plate from the upper frame. Out of time issues, just all sorts of CRAP from what was supposed to be THE best revolver made. The new Pythons don't really have any influence on the older model pricing. Only thing they really have in common is the name. They're two totally differently engineered guns.
Its fine about them not having collector value as I bought it to shoot (I cant really be a collector in my state as I need a separate permit for each and every handgun I own and they take months to get
). I didnt know that about the lock delete kit. I saw there was commentary about the guns locking up. Thanks for the knowledge . Thats interesting about Pythons, I never knew that, thanks for the knowledge again
. I thought they were interesting but far too expensive to take an interest in them.
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One of the very few advantages of being old. LOL!You probably both are right... You are fortunate that you can own 27 of them!
I began buying them in the early 1990s. This coincides with the surging of the Wonder 9 phenomenon, which held revolver prices down to being affordable. I remember buying a used Smith Model 63 (.22LR J-frame) & an older friend told me I paid WAY too much for it ($450). Now it's worth maybe twice that. I say all the time, there's no way I could have the collection I do now were I to begin as a young man today. They're too expensive!
From what I recall, the locking-up problem involved magnum calibers, i.e. .357 & .44 mag. LW frames too.Its fine about them not having collector value as I bought it to shoot (I cant really be a collector in my state as I need a separate permit for each and every handgun I own and they take months to get
Even were that not a concern, I have a problem with both the esthetics as well as the principal of the thing. I bet the guy who is making those delete kits is making bank.
Colt has quite the interesting history, IMO. Perhaps the most interesting of any major gun mfgr. They've flirted with bankruptcy ever since Sam Colt began the company. They've introduced some world class guns as well as stinking up the joint on QC as well as design (All-American 2000, Double Eagle). Not that they're alone in this type of thing, by any means. Every major mfgr has released their share of stinkers.Thats interesting about Pythons, I never knew that, thanks for the knowledge again
Some day, I'll get a book or two on the history of Colt & read it. I'm sure it'll be interesting reading.
You were fortunate to buy them when you did. Prices now are sky high which is how I ended up with a modern one.One of the very few advantages of being old. LOL!
I began buying them in the early 1990s. This coincides with the surging of the Wonder 9 phenomenon, which held revolver prices down to being affordable. I remember buying a used Smith Model 63 (.22LR J-frame) & an older friend told me I paid WAY too much for it ($450). Now it's worth maybe twice that. I say all the time, there's no way I could have the collection I do now were I to begin as a young man today. They're too expensive!
From what I recall, the locking-up problem involved magnum calibers, i.e. .357 & .44 mag. LW frames too.
Even were that not a concern, I have a problem with both the esthetics as well as the principal of the thing. I bet the guy who is making those delete kits is making bank.
Colt has quite the interesting history, IMO. Perhaps the most interesting of any major gun mfgr. They've flirted with bankruptcy ever since Sam Colt began the company. They've introduced some world class guns as well as stinking up the joint on QC as well as design (All-American 2000, Double Eagle). Not that they're alone in this type of thing, by any means. Every major mfgr has released their share of stinkers.
Some day, I'll get a book or two on the history of Colt & read it. I'm sure it'll be interesting reading.
At the time when I bought it I did not know much about the stupid lock. As I have gotten to know more I would never buy one with the lock today. I read a huge article last night about how it came to be. Very nasty business. I dont like it on aesthetics, function and principle. The whole anti-gun Clinton thing is ugly.
There appear to be a few guys making kits. No matter, I will not do it as I dont shoot it that much. The gun locking up while shooting is horrible. Very bad stuff.
I have often thought about seling it for a few reasons. Ammo for it has gotten expensive and I am cheap
. I also went through that whole Dirty Harry phase and I am over it. You are right about Colt. Been a trainwreck from pretty much day one. They have done many, many stupid things with their products over the years. Just look at the AR15, they own the rights to it even now. Now boutique AR15s are "the ones to own".
HK also has an interesting history and has changed hands a few times. I have not seen HK disembowel themselves the way Colt has done over the years.
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