[Junkball]

I converted my P30 V3 to a light LEM hybrid by purchasing a P2000 LEM hammer, cocking piece, and spring as seen here: HK P2000/P30 LEM parts. $75 Shipped - AR15.COM
It seems to function fine, but the reset is incredibly long, basically the full travel of the trigger back to its resting position. I've seen the P30 LEM reset compared with the V3 SA reset, but in my experience, the two are nowhere near one another. Is this because of the parts I used (are factory P30 LEMs different?), or typical for this setup?

Compressed to the break

The reset

At rest

I end up short stroking the trigger unless I very deliberately ride it back to the reset.

 

[TooSixy]

Not sure if the kit you got has everything. This is the P30 LEM kit and it looks like it has a few more parts. This probably is a heavy LEM kit (hammer spring is included).

HK P30 LEM Trigger Kit, RTG Gun Parts

 

[Junkball]

The hammer spring in the kit just makes for a heavier pull weight. That leaves the "control lever" (aka sear actuator latch on the P2000), the piece on the right, as the only thing I didn't receive. Does it differ from the V3 control lever? It looks like the part in the picture you posted above is the P2000 version, as seen in this thread: http://www.hkpro.com/forum/hk-handgun-talk/126824-improving-p30-da-sa-trigger-reset.html

The thread details how the P2000 control lever/sear actuator latch resulted in a shorter reset.
Perhaps that is the root of the long reset: the P30 V3 control lever is not meant to be used with the LEM setup?

 

[TooSixy]

The P2000 control latch in that thread looks exactly like the control latch in P30 (not P30S). See pic below.
Is that what you already have in your P30?

 

[Junkball]

The P2000 control latch in that thread looks exactly like the control latch in P30 (not P30S). See pic below.
Is that what you already have in your P30?

Yeah, I just took the fire control group apart again. The picture you posted is the one in my pistol. I guess that rules out the V3/P2000 control lever as a cause for the long reset.

 

[Junkball]

Anyone else do this conversion and experience any issues?

 

[P30]

Is this because of the parts I used (are factory P30 LEMs different?), or typical for this setup?

The reset of the P30 V2 is shorter than in the second picture. I handled a P2000 LEM in a gun shop, which also had a much longer reset than the V2. But I don't know, which are the parts that make the difference.

Do you know HK's ID numbers of your P2000 parts? I can give you the IDs of the relevant parts in the LEM P30. Then we could find the difference.

 

[chuck s]

Heck, just post 'em for us all!

-- Chuck

 

[R850R]

Just out of curiosity? Are you holding the trigger back while racking the slide and slowly allowing the trigger forward to reset? I know that if you pull the trigger without racking the slide, it will reset to the longer "DA" reset if the hammer is not cocked.

 

[P30]

Heck, just post 'em for us all!

The part numbers can be derived with the help of the German "Bedienungsanleitung" (operator's manual):
www.hktrophy.de/resources/HK+P30+und+P30L.pdf, page 54ff.

So, derived from the German manual, for a conversion from V3 to LEM you need:

31 Hammer with spur ("Schlaghebel mit Sporn") 209262
32 Cocking piece ("Spannstück") 209265
33 Cocking piece spring ("Schenkelfeder zum Schlaghebel") 209275

If you put in the parts listed above into a V3, then you get exactly the LEM P30 whose parts are specified in section 15.1 (sometimes called the "V0").

The trigger return spring can be exchanged to adjust the trigger weight:

20 Light trigger return spring (used in V0, V1, V3) ("Schenkelfeder zum Abzug") 234389
20 Heavy TRS (used in V2) 234405
20 Medium TRS (used in V4) 234773

The hammer above is the LEM hammer with spur. This is the LEM hammer without spur:

31.1 Hammer without spur ("Schlaghebel ohne Sporn") 209321

But I'm not sure, how this spurless hammer works in the conversion from V3 to LEM. HK does not produce a LEM P30 with the decocker (209261) and a spurless hammer.



PS: I've just found out that there are two different control levers:

31 Control lever (used in P30 V1, V2, V4) ("Steuerhebel") 209274
31 Control lever (used in P30 V0, V3 and in the P2000) 234487

But I don't know, if this part influences the trigger reset.


PPS: I've just found this: www.hk-usa.com/-images/shared/PSeries_Ops_Manual_060809.pdf, page 40f. There you find the differences, too, but in English. But in contrast to the German manual, the English manual says that the V3 has control lever 209274. So perhaps you have to exchange the control lever, too. Oh man, it's not so easy...

 

[TooSixy]

The part numbers can be derived with the help of the German "Bedienungsanleitung" (operator's manual):
www.hktrophy.de/resources/HK+P30+und+P30L.pdf, page 54ff.

So, derived from the German manual, for a conversion from V3 to LEM you need:

31 Hammer with spur ("Schlaghebel mit Sporn") 209262
32 Cocking piece ("Spannstück") 209265
33 Cocking piece spring ("Schenkelfeder zum Schlaghebel") 209275

If you put in the parts listed above into a V3, then you get exactly the LEM P30 whose parts are specified in section 15.1 (sometimes called the "V0").

The trigger return spring can be exchanged to adjust the trigger weight:

20 Light trigger return spring (used in V0, V1, V3) ("Schenkelfeder zum Abzug") 234389
20 Heavy TRS (used in V2) 234405
20 Medium TRS (used in V4) 234773

The hammer above is the LEM hammer with spur. This is the LEM hammer without spur:

31.1 Hammer without spur ("Schlaghebel ohne Sporn") 209321

But I'm not sure, how this spurless hammer works in the conversion from V3 to LEM. HK does not produce a LEM P30 with the decocker (209261) and a spurless hammer.



PS: I've just found out that there are two different control levers:

31 Control lever (used in P30 V1, V2, V4) ("Steuerhebel") 209274
31 Control lever (used in P30 V0, V3 and in the P2000) 234487

But I don't know, if this part influences the trigger reset.


PPS: I've just found this: www.hk-usa.com/-images/shared/PSeries_Ops_Manual_060809.pdf, page 40f. There you find the differences, too, but in English. But in contrast to the German manual, the English manual says that the V3 has control lever 209274. So perhaps you have to exchange the control lever, too. Oh man, it's not so easy...

The spurred hammer (209262), cocking piece (209265), and cocking piece spring (209275) are standard parts in V3 so you will keep those (with the exception of the spurred hammer) when converting from V3 to V2 or V1 LEM.

According to my notes, these are the parts that you will need for P30 LEM.

Parts for Heavy LEM V2 (P30/P30L):
1. Elbow spring for hammer - TRS (234405)
2. Release catch - sear (209320)
3. Control lever - control latch (209274)
4. Bobbed hammer (209321)
5. Heavy FPBS (209962) - standard in V3 (DA/SA) version

Light LEM V1:
1. Elbow spring for hammer - TRS (234389)
2. Light FPBS (209296)

 

[P30]

The spurred hammer (209262), cocking piece (209265), and cocking piece spring (209275) are standard parts in V3 so you will keep those (with the exception of the spurred hammer) when converting from V3 to V2 or V1 LEM.

There are two spurred hammers: LEM (209262) and V3 (209327).

I suppose, the control lever is the reason for the long reset in Junkball's P30. Because if Junkball did put in all LEM parts from this picture, then I suppose his trigger is similar to the V2 trigger but has a different control lever. He has still the V3 control lever which is 234487 according to the German manual. But the correct V2 control lever is 209274.

Furthermore I suppose the English manual gives a wrong number for the V3 control lever. The English manual says, V2 and V3 have the same control lever. If this would be true, then Junkball's P30 would contain all the relevant trigger parts of the V2 and should have the same reset.

Parts for Heavy LEM V2 (P30/P30L):
1. Elbow spring for hammer - TRS (234405)
2. Release catch - sear (209320)
3. Control lever - control latch (209274)
4. Bobbed hammer (209321)
5. Heavy FPBS (209962) - standard in V3 (DA/SA) version

I agree.

3:06 am now in Germany... I will go to bed.

 

[TooSixy]

@Junkball - I know member fatmat27 has converted all of his P30's from V3 to LEM. Why don't you PM him and ask if he can shed some lights on this.

 

[Junkball]

Just out of curiosity? Are you holding the trigger back while racking the slide and slowly allowing the trigger forward to reset? I know that if you pull the trigger without racking the slide, it will reset to the longer "DA" reset if the hammer is not cocked.

Yep.

The part numbers can be derived with the help of the German "Bedienungsanleitung" (operator's manual):
www.hktrophy.de/resources/HK+P30+und+P30L.pdf, page 54ff.

So, derived from the German manual, for a conversion from V3 to LEM you need:

31 Hammer with spur ("Schlaghebel mit Sporn") 209262
32 Cocking piece ("Spannstück") 209265
33 Cocking piece spring ("Schenkelfeder zum Schlaghebel") 209275

If you put in the parts listed above into a V3, then you get exactly the LEM P30 whose parts are specified in section 15.1 (sometimes called the "V0").

The hammer above is the LEM hammer with spur. This is the LEM hammer without spur:

31.1 Hammer without spur ("Schlaghebel ohne Sporn") 209321

But I'm not sure, how this spurless hammer works in the conversion from V3 to LEM. HK does not produce a LEM P30 with the decocker (209261) and a spurless hammer.



PS: I've just found out that there are two different control levers:

31 Control lever (used in P30 V1, V2, V4) ("Steuerhebel") 209274
31 Control lever (used in P30 V0, V3 and in the P2000) 234487

But I don't know, if this part influences the trigger reset.


PPS: I've just found this: www.hk-usa.com/-images/shared/PSeries_Ops_Manual_060809.pdf, page 40f. There you find the differences, too, but in English. But in contrast to the German manual, the English manual says that the V3 has control lever 209274. So perhaps you have to exchange the control lever, too. Oh man, it's not so easy...

This is interesting. My first thought is to trust the German manual. This is supported by the fact that the P2000 control lever seen in another thread I quoted was the same as the P30's. The only three parts I changed are the ones you listed above: 31, 32, and 33, with the exception being I'm using a spurless hammer. I didn't realize the P30 "V0" had a spurred hammer (is this even a real item? I've never seen a picture of a factory V0).

There are two spurred hammers: LEM (209262) and V3 (209327).

I suppose, the control lever is the reason for the long reset in Junkball's P30. Because if Junkball did put in all LEM parts from this picture, then I suppose his trigger is similar to the V2 trigger but has a different control lever. He has still the V3 control lever which is 234487 according to the German manual. But the correct V2 control lever is 209274.

Furthermore I suppose the English manual gives a wrong number for the V3 control lever. The English manual says, V2 and V3 have the same control lever. If this would be true, then Junkball's P30 would contain all the relevant trigger parts of the V2 and should have the same reset.


I agree.

3:06 am now in Germany... I will go to bed.

I can only arrive at your conclusion as well. Perhaps a V2 control lever would change the reset. However, I occasionally wonder if differences in trigger pulls from model to model, and even within a variant, are merely due to small manufacturing variances, where similar, but not completely identical parts, can be combined to give somewhat widely varying (relatively speaking) results.

Thank you for all your help, P30

Hopefully I can track a LEM control lever down and try that out!

 

[P30]

Thank you for all your help, P30

My pleasure! I'm considering to convert my V3 to LEM, too. So this thread is interesting for me, too.

BTW: I've read news here in Germany that KSK will replace their HK P8 by the P30. KSK are Germany's best military special forces. I could not find out yet, which trigger variant they will use. This is the article in Financial Times Deutschland: www.ftd.de/politik/deutschland/:bundeswehr-risse-im-pistolenlauf/60167103.html

My translation of the relevant part of the article (from February 10th):

"In addition the special forces KSK, which also operate in Afghanistan, use a special model of the P8, said a spokesman. It shall now be replaced by the P30 from Heckler & Koch. The order is placed, the processing will take some month."​

 

[fatmat27]

TV seems to be stuck on the Oscars............sooo

I've taken refuge in the kitchen taking the P30L apart (with the V3 parts for comparison). I noticed that the control levers had the slightest bit of difference, the LEM lever has a small dimple at the end of it (see above photos of the two). However, Re-installing the V3 lever in place of the LEM lever (while retaining all other LEM parts) did not change the trigger reset for me at all (or so I think).

The reset on both my P30's and P2000's are certainly longer than the USP's and HK45's but nothing close to the trigger resting point as you illustrated. For the life of me I could not rule this out to any one (other) part. I think it would be too expensive an endeavor to buy another kit with no promise of improvement so I would certainly count this as a fully justifiable GGI investment.

Anyone else have different results?

 

[Montrala]

I converted my P30L V3 into P30L V0 using hammer, cocking piece and elbow spring from P2000. Control lever is original and reset is same as it was in V3.

Also this control lever is exactly same as in my P2000SK V0, that was coverted to "US LEM" with bobbed hammer and LEM sear.

I do not know what differences are in two control levers (V0/V3 and new one), but it may be very small. Probably dimple on new version is there to easily distinguish one from other, because I do not see functional reason for this dimple.

Control lever has it's impact on reset distance, but not so big as OP posted. I think OP did not cycle slide before letting trigger go, or he expects trigger to make stop on reset point.

 

[Junkball]

Control lever has it's impact on reset distance, but not so big as OP posted. I think OP did not cycle slide before letting trigger go, or he expects trigger to make stop on reset point.

This is the second time this theory has been posted and the second time I'm refuting it. If you need to know, the picture process went like this:

1. Cycle slide
2. Pull trigger, keeping it completely depressed
3. Cycle slide again
4. Ride trigger slowly out until feeling/hearing the reset "click"

I'm wondering if it's just a certain combination of parts with allowable variances contributing to the longer reset... after all, trigger pulls vary even between identical models, much less a hybrid using P30/P2000 parts

 

[Montrala]

This is the second time this theory has been posted and the second time I'm refuting it. If you need to know, the picture process went like this:

1. Cycle slide
2. Pull trigger, keeping it completely depressed
3. Cycle slide again
4. Ride trigger slowly out until feeling/hearing the reset "click"

I'm wondering if it's just a certain combination of parts with allowable variances contributing to the longer reset... after all, trigger pulls vary even between identical models, much less a hybrid using P30/P2000 parts

Sorry then.

I tested some theory. If you misfit (or does not fit at all) small elbow spring that pushes hammer to the back, you will have long reset in result. It is very easy to make this mistake.

To verify:

1. Field strip pistol.
2. Cock hammer.
3. Press disconnector down (plate on right from controll lever).
4. While holding disconnector down pull the trigger and hold it.
5. Release disconnector.
6. While holding trigger look if hammer is still in fully rear position.
7. Look if you see legs of elbow spring sitting against sear and left side of hammer (if not, this may be problem)
8. To make sure: manually push hammer to maximum forward position and release it.
9. Hammer must very positively spring back to full back position - if not, then we know what happened.

 

[Junkball]

Sorry then.

I tested some theory. If you misfit (or does not fit at all) small elbow spring that pushes hammer to the back, you will have long reset in result. It is very easy to make this mistake.

To verify:

1. Field strip pistol.
2. Cock hammer.
3. Press disconnector down (plate on right from controll lever).
4. While holding disconnector down pull the trigger and hold it.
5. Release disconnector.
6. While holding trigger look if hammer is still in fully rear position.
7. Look if you see legs of elbow spring sitting against sear and left side of hammer (if not, this may be problem)
8. To make sure: manually push hammer to maximum forward position and release it.
9. Hammer must very positively spring back to full back position - if not, then we know what happened.

Very good, Montrala. This was it. I must have rotated the elbow spring during the installation, so that the forward leg was beneath the sear instead of resting upon its face. I reinstalled it correctly (took an hour! that sucker is tough to get right!), and tried it out. The reset is equivalent to my V3's. I find it interesting that the reset was somewhere between the proper length and a full reset for an uncocked trigger pull when I had the spring mis-installed. The fact that it still functioned almost 100% is a tribute to HK's engineering, or my stupidity, you pick.

Thanks for the help, Montrala