I'm looking for my first conceal carry and am very interested in the HK P30's. I've been trying to find the difference in the effective ranges and muzzle velocities for each version (I know that the type of ammunition factors into this - just trying to find an 'apples-to-apples' comparison. I haven't found anything. Can anyone point me to where I might be able to find this? Thanks a bunch!!
P30SK/P30/P30L Difference in Effective Ranges and Muzzle Velocities
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For self-defense range (25 yards and) I don't think differences in velocity between 3.2, 3.8, or 4.5 barrels are going to be much of a factor. Unless you have really soft handloads, 9mm and/or .40SW would be pretty flat to 25 yards (even further) with most ammo.
I think the biggest differentiators would be sight radius and overall size/weight. Generally speaking the longer the sight radius the better the sight picture, so it's 'easier' to keep things on target. Also generally speaking, the bigger/heavier pistol will better absorb felt recoil (but there are probably lots of arguments/flame wars about that).
Some bigger guys can conceal anything, so they opt for full-size pistols to get the benefits of additional magazine capacity, longer sight radius, and recoil mitigation. Most people can't effectively conceal a bigger gun, so they downsize from there, but I've never heard of muzzle velocity or 'effective range' being considerations.
I'd definitely be interested in reading any comparison information if it exists...
I think the biggest differentiators would be sight radius and overall size/weight. Generally speaking the longer the sight radius the better the sight picture, so it's 'easier' to keep things on target. Also generally speaking, the bigger/heavier pistol will better absorb felt recoil (but there are probably lots of arguments/flame wars about that).
Some bigger guys can conceal anything, so they opt for full-size pistols to get the benefits of additional magazine capacity, longer sight radius, and recoil mitigation. Most people can't effectively conceal a bigger gun, so they downsize from there, but I've never heard of muzzle velocity or 'effective range' being considerations.
I'd definitely be interested in reading any comparison information if it exists...
It would be interesting to check velocities of each. I might try that next week because I was going to test some Norma ( lightweight bullets) ammo for expansion. I could add a quick velocity aspect. And see if the box ie 1325fps is realistic in a full sized gun.
I don’t really think it will matter in real life SD situations in general, but there are always exception. Bullet choice and placement always trump, but I’ll test it for funzies.
PB
I don’t really think it will matter in real life SD situations in general, but there are always exception. Bullet choice and placement always trump, but I’ll test it for funzies.
PB
124gr9mm.
Thanks for sharing your perspective from your experience. I very much appreciate it. You raise good points that I hadn't focused too much on. Your perspective on sight radius makes lots of sense. The SK is about a half of an inch shorter in length and a half of an inch shorter in height compared to the P30, while the only difference between the P30 and P30L is the barrel length (+0.6 inches). Looks like I'll be heading to the local gun shop to check all three out - with your advice in mind. Thanks, again!
PappaBear,
Thanks for your reply!! That sounds interesting if you have a chance to check that out. I guess that I was thinking that a higher muzzle velocity for a given ammunition would provide greater force on impact. You are right - bullet choice and placement are more important. What ammo do you use for SD? - JHP? I am assuming that target practice is with FMJ and carry is with JHP, or am I mistaken?
Thanks, again, for your time!
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I have not seen the velocities of the three P30s in one test, but there is info out there such as this about the M&P 2.0 with a 3.6, 4.0, 4.25 and 5 inch barrels (chart half way down the article)
==> An NRA Shooting Sports Journal | Pistol Barrel Length And Velocity
There's also short barrel ammo out there such as Sig P365 9mm, Speer Gold Dot which you may want to look in to.
==> An NRA Shooting Sports Journal | Pistol Barrel Length And Velocity
There's also short barrel ammo out there such as Sig P365 9mm, Speer Gold Dot which you may want to look in to.
+1.
A barrel is a barrel in the context of this thread, and where SD statistically occurs within 3-7 yds is insignificant. Compact/subcompact/micro exists primarily for CC, why ammo manufacturers developed short-barrel loads.
HK… I carry more my P30SK than my P30, when I carry a ‘full size’ it’s more my P2000/USP9c.
All around my SD load is Fed HST 124 +P JHP.
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I read this somewhere, I don't recall where. This will be generic & not ammo nor gun brand specific as well.
For a handgun, the advertised velocity will usually be from a 6" barrel. For every inch below 6", deduct 50fps. IOW, a 4" bbl will be 100fps slower than the 6".
For a rifle, I believe it was a 20" bbl, but it may have been 22"? I'm going to use 20" since that's an AR bbl length standard. They said to deduct 100fps per inch below the 20". Thus a 16" bbl will be shooting 400fps slower.
Yes, I know there's all sorts of "what ifs?" in there that one could drive a Mack truck through. Short bbl ammo, for example. Quick burning powder, etc. Type of rifling is another variant as I believe H&K pistols typically shoot a bit faster (not sure how much) than say a XD or M&P. Less friction is what I was told when I asked about it. Traditional land & groove rifling uses a bit more of a "grab" in order to extract accuracy.
OP, there won't be a dime's worth of difference in "effectiveness" in the guns you're looking at. You may well shoot better with a medium to full size gun due to the longer sight radius. Or you might stumble onto something like I have with my USPC S/S .45acp that shoots insanely accurate using cheap, bulk PMC ammo. As already mentioned, find the gun that fits your hand the best & the one you shoot the best. (They're not always the same, IMO.) Don't put a huge amount in stock with the accuracy of a range rental gun as they're not cleaned too often, if at all. Don't be worried if your first choice turns out to not be your best choice. No one says you can't trade it off or sell it for something else.
My opinion(s) is worth exactly what you paid for them.
For a handgun, the advertised velocity will usually be from a 6" barrel. For every inch below 6", deduct 50fps. IOW, a 4" bbl will be 100fps slower than the 6".
For a rifle, I believe it was a 20" bbl, but it may have been 22"? I'm going to use 20" since that's an AR bbl length standard. They said to deduct 100fps per inch below the 20". Thus a 16" bbl will be shooting 400fps slower.
Yes, I know there's all sorts of "what ifs?" in there that one could drive a Mack truck through. Short bbl ammo, for example. Quick burning powder, etc. Type of rifling is another variant as I believe H&K pistols typically shoot a bit faster (not sure how much) than say a XD or M&P. Less friction is what I was told when I asked about it. Traditional land & groove rifling uses a bit more of a "grab" in order to extract accuracy.
OP, there won't be a dime's worth of difference in "effectiveness" in the guns you're looking at. You may well shoot better with a medium to full size gun due to the longer sight radius. Or you might stumble onto something like I have with my USPC S/S .45acp that shoots insanely accurate using cheap, bulk PMC ammo. As already mentioned, find the gun that fits your hand the best & the one you shoot the best. (They're not always the same, IMO.) Don't put a huge amount in stock with the accuracy of a range rental gun as they're not cleaned too often, if at all. Don't be worried if your first choice turns out to not be your best choice. No one says you can't trade it off or sell it for something else.
My opinion(s) is worth exactly what you paid for them.
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This is a good point.
In the case of a new shooter, there's no frame of reference for hard vs soft recoil, ease of acquiring sight picture, grip angle, and tons of other factors that go into shooting a pistol.
It's always a good idea to start off with a reliable manufacturer, but after a few months (or years for some) it's not unusual to gravitate to another pistol.
Instead of trading/selling I'd just ADD to the collection, but that's just me...
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Unless it's an H&K, then that is always the best choice.
HK FunGuns,
Thank you very much for the link. That's really interesting! I previously thought that the longer the barrel, the faster the ammo. From the article, I can see that there are more factors at play than just barrel length. Thanks, again!
Reloader5,
Thanks for taking the time to check that out - and for sharing that information!! I would be interested in the SK data whenever you get the chance!
GasGuzz,
Great data point. Thank you for sharing your thoughts!
Barth,What you shoot the best and are willing to carry is the difference
Agreed. It's just that I don't have the experience with lots of pistols to be able to get to that point yet. Gotta start somewhere, I guess. Thanks for your thoughts!
bobsguns,I read this somewhere, I don't recall where. This will be generic & not ammo nor gun brand specific as well.
For a handgun, the advertised velocity will usually be from a 6" barrel. For every inch below 6", deduct 50fps. IOW, a 4" bbl will be 100fps slower than the 6".
For a rifle, I believe it was a 20" bbl, but it may have been 22"? I'm going to use 20" since that's an AR bbl length standard. They said to deduct 100fps per inch below the 20". Thus a 16" bbl will be shooting 400fps slower.
Yes, I know there's all sorts of "what ifs?" in there that one could drive a Mack truck through. Short bbl ammo, for example. Quick burning powder, etc. Type of rifling is another variant as I believe H&K pistols typically shoot a bit faster (not sure how much) than say a XD or M&P. Less friction is what I was told when I asked about it. Traditional land & groove rifling uses a bit more of a "grab" in order to extract accuracy.
OP, there won't be a dime's worth of difference in "effectiveness" in the guns you're looking at. You may well shoot better with a medium to full size gun due to the longer sight radius. Or you might stumble onto something like I have with my USPC S/S .45acp that shoots insanely accurate using cheap, bulk PMC ammo. As already mentioned, find the gun that fits your hand the best & the one you shoot the best. (They're not always the same, IMO.) Don't put a huge amount in stock with the accuracy of a range rental gun as they're not cleaned too often, if at all. Don't be worried if your first choice turns out to not be your best choice. No one says you can't trade it off or sell it for something else.
My opinion(s) is worth exactly what you paid for them.
That's some great information and sage advice! Thank you very much for taking the time to share! You have a good point on my 'effective range' question. There's too many variables and, I guess, in most anticipated AD distances there's probably as much variation based on shooting ability as there is from design. Also, I don't want to get so caught up in the details that I put off doing SOMETHING. Thanks again for shariing your experiences and thoughts!!
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You're very welcome!
Try to find a rental range to expand your experience among different brands & models. Having a few friends with an extensive collection is also another great way to check them out. Be sure to use your own store-bought ammo so as not to burn up theirs!
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