[prebans]

I'm very new to HK and HK clone firearms, but the notion of a HK-51 or a HK-51B interests me. Starting with either a Vector V51-P or a PTR-91 PDW seems to be the best way to begin this project.

While I've done a lot of searching both here and elsewhere, there seem to be conflicting reports and no consensus.

Any thoughts about these two pistols? Reliability/durability? I'm not asking about combat use, more for not having the multitude of embarrassing stoppages that seem to occur at every NFA shoot. Is one known to be of better quality than the other?

Also, the PTR seems to be less expensive. That said, I'm not fond of its metal handguard; I really prefer the wider polymer handguard found on the Vector. Does anybody know if this is easy to swap out on the PTR, or is there something going on with that design that precludes the use of a wider handguard? If it is possible, does anybody know what handguard Vector used on its V51-P? That metal handguard not only looks uncomfortable, but it also looks like it'd act like a big metal heat sink.

Finally, any differences with SBRing either gun? Converting to B (beltfed) specs? I understand that the beltgun conversion is very involved and requires a good 'smith. I also understand that markings and serial numbers must be handled properly. Any advice or recommendations there? (One person advised me that I'd first have to do the beltfed work and then the SBR papering to avoid problems.) One person said that I'd have to adjust the Vector's guide/recoil (?) rod while PTR's is fine for a SBR as it is. Any truth to this?

Thanks,

Mike

 

[rhouston8]

You got fairly large balls if you are going down the full auto beltfed 51 route from scratch more or less. I wouldn't rec' that as an entry project into the HK platform.

Several 'smiths on the board here build nice flamethrower crowd pleasing .308 beasts. Here's a friend shooting my Michael's Machines 51 with a 50 round drum.
Is this the effect you are aiming for? The gun pictured is very reliable but it's not a "k" which has the even shorter barrel and is apparently much more difficult to build into a safe reliable full auto gun. Also search the site for Ghillie bear "Baby Dragon". I'm betting that you'll experience much less heartache just having a custom build done for you by one of the pros. I apologize in advance if I'm way off in left field with my rec'.

I agree with you on the metal handguard thing. I greatly dislike them and am unfortunate enough to have one on my PTR 32. They are heavy, get hot, and are ugly. Seems it doesnt allow for easy replacement on my gun but I havent tried very hard either.

https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/dnL5e_sPjs2C8JtOeiq3ucit8Yql0ctOMuOh_qleAQM?feat=directlink

https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/l60orVtuCUks7qqrqFwevsit8Yql0ctOMuOh_qleAQM?feat=directlink

Good luck with your project and let us know of its progress and end result.

-HH

 

[prebans]

Hello!

Thank you! Yeah, it's going to be a very involved project. I've done other crazy projects before- every time, you're stepping in over your head. I guess that's the nature of the beast.

My original thought was to go SBR first and then do beltfed, but apparently there's some rule about it being okay to move and remove markings from Title I guns (barring serial numbers) but it's never legal to alter markings on Title II guns. So, looks like I get to build the world's first beltfed pistol and later slap a stock on it.

What issues have you found with replacing the PTR foregrip?

Mike

 

[rhouston8]

"What issues have you found with replacing the PTR foregrip?"

Man...on my PTR 32 it's hex screwed on there super tight and I didnt readily see how even with those screws out just how the metal foreguard would be able to come off cleanly. The foreguard appeared to hug tightly around the barrel precluding its removal. Then again...I just spent about 2 minutes messing with it and decided to leave it and move on. I don't know if its the exact same type of foreguard or not as the 91 clone.

Here's a few vids of mine which may show what I'm talking about.

https://picasaweb.google.com/rhoust...authkey=Gv1sRgCMydwOL5mZKYnAE&feat=directlink

I would like to replace that guard with the plastic wide body. Heck I need a good end cap for it as well as I don't want my sear living in that host all the time.

-HH

 

[prebans]

"What issues have you found with replacing the PTR foregrip?"

Man...on my PTR 32 it's hex screwed on there super tight and I didnt readily see how even with those screws out just how the metal foreguard would be able to come off cleanly. The foreguard appeared to hug tightly around the barrel precluding its removal. Then again...I just spent about 2 minutes messing with it and decided to leave it and move on. I don't know if its the exact same type of foreguard or not as the 91 clone.

Here's a few vids of mine which may show what I'm talking about.

https://picasaweb.google.com/rhoust...authkey=Gv1sRgCMydwOL5mZKYnAE&feat=directlink

I would like to replace that guard with the plastic wide body. Heck I need a good end cap for it as well as I don't want my sear living in that host all the time.

-HH

Interesting. I may call the manufacturer tomorrow to question them about how to swap the handguard. I don't like its design in the first place, and I certainly don't want to have my off hand controlling the firearm using a glorified heat sink.

Mike

 

[Atlantic Firearms.com]

We run a Vector V51 with a full auto sear and butt stock it is a real crowd pleaser at local shoots and demos. The PTR PDW does not have the full auto carrier and this will need to be modified or replaced but we have several customers that do this . If you are looking for the PTR PDW .308 pistols we have several in stock and offer discounts to HK Pro members.

 

[gunz213]

You can't beat the PTR for the price. I got my carrier rewelded by Ghilliebear for $100 and swapping the handguard only took a couple minutes. It's easy to put a stock on the PRT also, just remove 3 screws and your A2 stock or ACE folder will bolt right up.

 

[GFarmer13]

The forearm is as easily replaced as the stock/end cap on the PTR 91PDW. I put a 53 forearm on Mine and it looks great. I posted a pic on the thread Can we see What you got in the clone sec. Its a big picure so you could open it and see the forearm on the weapon. You will have to get a small pin with your new forearm as the screw that holds the factory one screws into a band that is part of the forearm. The pin hanger is in place for the push pin. Hope this helps.

 

[99HMC4]

So your dont know how the hand guard mounts but you want to convert it to a belt fed? Go PTR PDW, I NEVER had sn issuexwuth mine till I suppressed it....

 

[prebans]

So your dont know how the hand guard mounts but you want to convert it to a belt fed? Go PTR PDW, I NEVER had sn issuexwuth mine till I suppressed it....

Nope. Gotta start somewhere with every idea. I'm starting here.

Mike

 

[JTinIN]

Take a look at the "K" version of the HK21e, plus you can also change to 223. Is a little longer with a 11" barrel vs 8.5" barrel, however, you can purchase one that is currently being made by http://michaelsmachines.com/.

Photo is of my MM23eK which is same but in 223 (can covert once I decide on the options and 308 vs 7.62x39 ;-).

 

[Anopstyx]

Whoaaa that is nice John!

 

[kabob]

Dangit, I wish I'd known that Atlantic Firearms offered us discounts when I bought my PTR PDW from them two months ago.

 

[MOUNTAIN WILLIAM]

The forend is a simple swap albeit with a tight screw on the PTR, just go slow so that the metal forend doesn't scratch anything during the removal process. The wide MP5 forend is what's normally used but the wide 53 forend is slightly longer and looks more proportional. I prefer the MP5 slimline myself.
HK94 MP5 U.S. Made Handgaurd, 922 compliant, RTG Gun Parts

 

[hkindiana]

Agreed +1 to this. Does anyone know what their discount is for my NEXT order

Dangit, I wish I'd known that Atlantic Firearms offered us discounts when I bought my PTR PDW from them two months ago.

 

[hkindiana]

Hand guard is easy to change. PTR is much cheaper, but does have a semi bolt carrier. Instead of paying $100 to weld up the carrier, order a factory full auto carrier from HK parts for $129.00, and sell your semi carrier on Gun Broker for $89.00 (that's what I did to save $70 and have a factory vs welded up carrier). The Vector is also cut for the drum, and PTR is not. However, if you want this done, I've heard Ghilliebear does a great job. Personally, I don't like the look of the magwell once it s cut for a drum, and 40 round mags seem sufficient. I too, had a hard time deciding between the PTR and the Vector, but I eventually went with the PTR, and am glad I did. From reports, PTR is more reliable, and mine works flawlessly in both semi and full auto. I hope this info helps.