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Great points and always appreciate your input!
 

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Thanks for the fantastic post, Big Bore.

I'd like to ask a few questions if you don't mind:

1. Since the stock TR and FPB springs are the ones that make the LEM trigger pull light, are you saying that it's the other parts of the LEM kit (e.g. hammer, etc.) that lower the factory 11lb DA pull on the V1/V2/V9/V10 to the light 5lb LEM pull? I was under the impression that the TR, FPB, and main/hammer springs that came with the kit were the ones that lightened the factory 11lb DA pull.

2. What benefits do the match trigger kit offer as compared to the LEM kit (other than the latter being DAO)?

3. Is it really possible to combine both kits (like in the Combat Competition model) to a) lighten the DA pull (perhaps using the LEM kit) and b) to lighten the SA pull (using the Match Trigger kit)?

Thanks in advance. :)
 

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Discussion Starter · #23 ·
Thanks for the fantastic post, Big Bore.

I'd like to ask a few questions if you don't mind:

1. Since the stock TR and FPB springs are the ones that make the LEM trigger pull light, are you saying that it's the other parts of the LEM kit (e.g. hammer, etc.) that lower the factory 11lb DA pull on the V1/V2/V9/V10 to the light 5lb LEM pull? I was under the impression that the TR, FPB, and main/hammer springs that came with the kit were the ones that lightened the factory 11lb DA pull.
What lightens the DA pull from the standard DA to the LEM is the fact that the hammer spring is fully compressed before you start your LEM trigger pull. When shooting LEM you only have the cocking piece spring, TRS, and FPB springs to overcome before taking the shot. In the DA pull on the standard variants you must fully compress the hammer spring to take the shot, just like when you dry fire the LEM trigger without first racking the slide.
2. What benefits do the match trigger kit offer as compared to the LEM kit (other than the latter being DAO)?
The benefits would be in the eye of the beholder. Even with the match trigger kit you still have SA/DA and the first shot is heavier than the follow up shots. With the LEM all shots are the same, first to last. The match trigger should not really be compared to the LEM since they are apples and oranges. The match trigger compared to the standard V1 trigger is marginally lighter but much smoother, crisp, no over travel, and feels about a pound lighter than it is. IMO the best trigger every made for a HK is the Match/LEM hybrid used on the Combat Competition which is as the name implies, a mix of the match trigger and the LEM trigger. You end up with a very light 4.5 pound LEM trigger pull with no over travel due to the match trigger OT stop screw. The Match TRS, FPBS, flat spring, and hammer spring combined with the LEM kit all mesh to make one fantastic trigger with the best of both worlds.
3. Is it really possible to combine both kits (like in the Combat Competition model) to a) lighten the DA pull (perhaps using the LEM kit) and b) to lighten the SA pull (using the Match Trigger kit)?

Thanks in advance. :)
No, you cannot combine anything in the LEM kit that will lighten the Match trigger and still retain SA/DA function. It is the Match trigger parts that serve to lighten and smooth out the LEM trigger. If you use the two-piece hammer from the LEM kit, which is what lightens the DA pull, you will no longer have SA function.
 

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Whoa, that was quick! Thanks so much. Some follow ups if I May:

In the DA pull on the standard variants you must fully compress the hammer spring to take the shot, just like when you dry fire the LEM trigger without first racking the slide.
Okay. I think I finally got it. Sounds to me like the LEM trigger system works like the SA principle of the DA/SA models except that there is a longer slack and the hammer always starts from the forward position.

No, you cannot combine anything in the LEM kit that will lighten the Match trigger and still retain SA/DA function. It is the Match trigger parts that serve to lighten and smooth out the LEM trigger. If you use the two-piece hammer from the LEM kit, which is what lightens the DA pull, you will no longer have SA function.
Actually, I was indeed pertaining to the Match/LEM hybrid trigger of the Combat Competition. I didn't know that it was actually a DAO system.

Thanks so much for your helpful inputs. Would you know of any way to lessen both the DA and SA pull (and still maintain the DA/SA functionality)?
 

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Discussion Starter · #25 ·
The only way to do that so far as I know is to send the pistol to Bill Springfield or Bruce Gray for a trigger job.
 

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Big Bore, is it possible to convert the new Hk45c to the LEM, retaining the safety as was done in your original post? Being used to keeping the thumb on the safety while firing, I cannot seem to avoid decocking the pistol during rapid fire. Plus, I'm not a huge fan of the decocker anyway.

Lastly, isn't the new P30s supposed to be the LEM with a safety?

Thanks
 

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I was told it needs a new detent plate, that is on order from germany, to have LEM and keep the safety. For some reason V9 comes to mind but im not sure which plate it is exactly.
 

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I need help. Have been trying to install LEM kit on a USP 9mm Compact. Everything went together but the gun won't fire. The hammer will move back when you pull the trigger but it does not actually cock.
If anyone knows a competent HK smith in the Seattle/Tacoma area, please let me know. I have kits for my HK45 and HK45C but obviously I am not moving forward with them until I get this straightened out.
Any help of any kind will be appreciated.
 

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Discussion Starter · #29 ·
Check your cocking piece spring. I bet the legs are out of position. Also, check that you did not damage the flat spring when you put the kit. Go back and double check each part is in position with the directions that are posted. Too many people have done this easily and successfully so you must have a part out of place. My money is on the cocking piece spring. Also, you didn't get a LEM kit for the HK45 did you? All USP/USPC LEM kits are the same but the HK45 kit is different. If you bought three HK45 kits then it is not going to work in the USPC.
 

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Discussion Starter · #30 ·
Big Bore, is it possible to convert the new Hk45c to the LEM, retaining the safety as was done in your original post? Being used to keeping the thumb on the safety while firing, I cannot seem to avoid decocking the pistol during rapid fire. Plus, I'm not a huge fan of the decocker anyway.

Lastly, isn't the new P30s supposed to be the LEM with a safety?

Thanks
When you put in the LEM kit and retain the safety the decocker will no longer work, but it will depress. If you want it not to depress at all, get the V9/10 detent plate.
I know very little about the P30 but I don't think the P30S is an LEM, but I really do not follow that pistol at all.
 

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Discussion Starter · #31 ·
I was told it needs a new detent plate, that is on order from germany, to have LEM and keep the safety. For some reason V9 comes to mind but im not sure which plate it is exactly.
If you want to be able to ride the safety and not have it depress, then you need the V9 detent plate. However, keeping the V1 detent plate in there will give you the safety function but it will no longer decock. That function is deactivated with the addition of the LEM kit unless the HK45 is a lot different than the USP and USPC, and I don't think it is in that regard.
You can get detent plates from several places besides HK. HKPARTS.net, HKSPECIALIST.net, and Gun Parts Corp, all may have them.
 

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Legs are in position. I checked and rechecked that. I was wondering if the strut is out of position? And no, I have the kits separate. This kit is definitely for the USP. The other kits are still in their bags properly marked.
 

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I am pretty sure there was a post on HK-usa and the tech said indeed it was different than a USP and needed a different detent plate. Here is the link to what I am referring to http://www.hk-usa.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=6794 I havent actually looked up the part number yet so im not exactly sure what Variant the plate is. The thread I posted is kinds of vague but it let me to believe it was different from a USP. What do you think BigBore?
 

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Discussion Starter · #35 ·
I am pretty sure there was a post on HK-usa and the tech said indeed it was different than a USP and needed a different detent plate. Here is the link to what I am referring to http://www.hk-usa.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=6794 I havent actually looked up the part number yet so im not exactly sure what Variant the plate is. The thread I posted is kinds of vague but it let me to believe it was different from a USP. What do you think BigBore?
You do need the V9 variant plate but one for the HK45/C. Indeed the USP/C and HK45/C detent plates are different. I am not sure who will actually have them but if none of those people have them then you pretty much will have to wait until HK gets them in.
 

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Discussion Starter · #36 ·
I need help in positioning the hammer strut so that it works with the ratchet in the hammer. I think that that is the crux of my problem.
Did you take out the hammer strut when you took out the guts? I have always left the hammer strut in place and it goes right back into the proper position once you get it all back together and put in the hammer spring and lanyard loop. If you removed the hammer strut, make sure you do not have it in backwards, if that is even possible.
 

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Hi, yes I took it out and should not have. But it is facing properly, according to the schematic. I am just not clear on how it should fit inside, plus I am not sure I have the ractchet installed inside the hammer properly.
 

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Discussion Starter · #38 ·
The cocking piece, the part you are calling the ratchet, can pretty much only go in one way IIRC. Make sure you have it assembled just like the picture in the directions in the first post of this thread. The hammer strut, after looking at it, of course can only go in one way. It has been so long since I looked at one I really could not recall what it looked like. Getting old and the memory... something another, I forget.
The upper part of the hammer strut fits into the notch in the back of the hammer and rests against the cocking piece. I don't see how it could be wrong unless you can assemble the cocking piece backwards. I think I would take one of your other kits and see if it is physically possible to get the cocking piece inside the hammer backwards and still have the hole in the cocking piece and hammer line up. If you can assemble it backwards then that would sure cause your problems.
Also, check to make sure the hook on the catch goes around the hammer axle. Again, I don't think you can get it together if it does not, but double check anyway.
 

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If converting to LEM and retaining the control lever wouldn't it be the V5,V6 detent plate which is listed as LEM with control lever? Or is the V9,V10 the same?




Edit: V5,6,9 and 10 are the same detent plate.
 
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