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+1 for **** Gould, always does a great job with Michael Mann's films and often has the actors shoot live-fire on the range during the pre-film training! He did this with Cruise for Collateral also and it really shows.
 

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+1 for **** Gould, always does a great job with Michael Mann's films and often has the actors shoot live-fire on the range during the pre-film training! He did this with Cruise for Collateral also and it really shows.
He actually had DeNiro, Kilmer, and Sizemore "Case" a bank for HEAT...had to go in and note everything and report back to Gould--and its said that a couple of different trainers show the shootout form HEAT showcasing Val Kilmer's tactical reload of his Colt Commando--its smooth and rapid--saying "If a hollywood actor can do this you better be able to do it too!"

of course I dont get paid to learn from **** Gould...so y'know
 

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The Casing of the Bank for "HEAT"

Actually, the casing of the bank skills were honed by another SAS operator named Andy McNab (pseudonym). If you watch the DVD extras, they interview McNab about this (his face is shadowed to protect his identity due to the enemies supposedly hunting him in real life).

McNab is now a writer who has done many novels centering on a character named Nick Stone. Stone is an ex-SAS turned "K", which is a deniable operator. The tradecraft in the novels is excellent.

Vanguard.45
 

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Vanguard...what are the titles of the novels? I have been dissapointed in Tom Clancy as of late, his details which have always been superb, are seriously lacking. Unfortunately, I am such a "gun dork" that it really zaps my interest for the story. I would be interested in reading some of what you mentioned....
 

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Here you go!

Nick Stone Missions

Remote Control (17 February 1998)
Crisis Four (22 August 2000)
Firewall (5 October 2000)
Last Light (1 October 2001)
Liberation Day (1 October 2002)
Dark Winter (3 November 2003)
Deep Black (1 November 2004)
Aggressor (1 November 2005)
Recoil (6 November 2006)
Crossfire (12 November 2007)
Brute Force (3 November 2008)
Exit Wound (5 November 2009)
Zero Hour (25 November 2010)
Dead Centre (15 September 2011)

Some of the later ones you can get on amazon.co.uk as they were not published on this side of the pond! Awesome books!
 

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Here are the shots fired in the "Club Scene":

Two shots to the Cartel guy about to shoot Jamie Fox
Two shots over the head of the moustached Cartel member into the wall
Three shots into the submachinegun wielding blonde asian guy (this is shown twice from two perspectives)
Two shots to the bodyguard moving across the screen from right to left (Cruise is kneeling)
One shot to the bodyguard with the shotgun to Cruise's right (shotgun goes off as the bodyguard falls)
Two shots to the bodyguard in the white coat trying to pull the target to safety
One shot to the target

RELOAD

Two quick shots to target
One aimed shot to target's thinkin' box

There you have it, fellas. Thirteen shots before the reload. Period. End of story.


The confusion often stems from the three shots taken while Cruise is lying down which is shown twice for effect. Pretty doubtful Cruise would have needed SIX rapid shots from a .45 to drop a skinny asian guy! The scene is repeated for effect since six rapid shots sound and look cooler than just three (although that whole scene is awesome, IMHO)!

Full Size HK USP in .45ACP

Glad to be of service.
Alright, I'm bringing this post back to life for a short breath. But ya, I've studied this clip in detail literally 50+ times before I even stumbled upon the thread. I'll agree with all your counts except how many he uses to light up the skinny asian guy with the submachine gun.

1.) If you claim the director filmed that "3 shot sequence" twice using two angles, fine. However, if you watch the second angle closely you will CLEARLY hear 4 shots, not 3. Since he shoots the skinny asian dude up with 4 shots, he uses a total of 14, not 13.

2.) Now if we go with the assumption that the director did NOT use two angles and they were all sequential shots, then the total he used becomes 18, which is how much the USP 9 Law Enforcement magazine holds.

#2 is what I would like to believe because given such an expert that Vincent was, he should have really had 18 + 1 in the chamber to begin with. He fires 18 but leaves the last one in the chamber during reload as he's suppose to (in case he needed to shoot it during reload). After reload, he again has 18+1.

Now having said that, I am in no way trying to stir up anything about it being a USP 9 since Michael Mann himself claimed it to be a .45... but I have to say I was really surprised when I heard it was a .45 considering he consistently did double taps millimeters apart so quickly. I think to be able to sleep on this (for myself at least), I'm accepting that Hollywood made up an inaccurate total magazine count for that scene, using a .45.
 

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It sure looks like either a Colt's Huntsman or Woodsman to me.
 

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Alright, I'm bringing this post back to life for a short breath. But ya, I've studied this clip in detail literally 50+ times before I even stumbled upon the thread. I'll agree with all your counts except how many he uses to light up the skinny asian guy with the submachine gun.

1.) If you claim the director filmed that "3 shot sequence" twice using two angles, fine. However, if you watch the second angle closely you will CLEARLY hear 4 shots, not 3. Since he shoots the skinny asian dude up with 4 shots, he uses a total of 14, not 13.

2.) Now if we go with the assumption that the director did NOT use two angles and they were all sequential shots, then the total he used becomes 18, which is how much the USP 9 Law Enforcement magazine holds.

#2 is what I would like to believe because given such an expert that Vincent was, he should have really had 18 + 1 in the chamber to begin with. He fires 18 but leaves the last one in the chamber during reload as he's suppose to (in case he needed to shoot it during reload). After reload, he again has 18+1.

Now having said that, I am in no way trying to stir up anything about it being a USP 9 since Michael Mann himself claimed it to be a .45... but I have to say I was really surprised when I heard it was a .45 considering he consistently did double taps millimeters apart so quickly. I think to be able to sleep on this (for myself at least), I'm accepting that Hollywood made up an inaccurate total magazine count for that scene, using a .45.
1. I was Tom Cruise's shooting double and I shoot .45 double taps mms apart all the time (just kidding).
2. I heard the 4th shot as well, but only three sbots are actually fired. Even more evidence Mann was just trying to make it seem like Vincent was shooting LOTS of rounds in rapid succession to wow the audience (and it worked).
3. I would take 13 45s over 18 9mms any day of the week. Some would say I'm an expert. By the logic being used in your comments, an expert should have had a 100 round drum magazine. I think Vincent's speed at reloading more than made up for his lower capacity magazines!
 

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excellent movie. I almost bought a usp 45 right after watching it then my bank slapped me back to reality.
 

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He used both a H&K USP and a Ruger Mk II with integrated suppressor. He used the Ruger to kill the nightclub owner, and the H&K USP to kill
the homies who stole his briefcase.





Picture of the actual USP 45 used in the movie.

 

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Two to the chest and one to the head is very common in most training.

IDPA is based on this technique as well.
 
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