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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
WTB: HK registered trigger frame ($27.5k) or non-S&H sear. DEAL MADE

This is a WTB (want to buy) ad posted in the 'WANTED TO BUY HK PARTS AND ACCESSORIES' forum.

I'm looking for a registered HK trigger frame such as the more commonly known DLO trigger box. I also prefer to buy just the frame since I already bought the MP5K-N host gun, but if it must come bundled with a gun, preferably its another MP5K-N, a used shooter would be ideal. If there's such a thing as a registered ambi+burst trigger frame that wasn't modified from SEF to burst (started as 4 position ambidextrous), then I'd be interested in that too. Ultimately, it must be a trigger frame that can be modified for 4 position ambidextrous (or already be modified for such). If it comes in a trigger pack or pack + housing, 4 position is what I would use, and we would adjust for a higher sale price.

I'd also consider the purchase of a Fleming or Qualified sear that is free of any grinding or welding. Again, if it comes in a pack, 4 position is what I would use.

Known registered components that I would purchase from, offers are assuming bare component without trigger pack:
  1. DLO trigger frame $27,500.00
  2. Tim Lafrance trigger frame $27,500.00
  3. another brand trigger frame $27,500.00
  4. Fleming sear $24,000
  5. Qualified sear $23,500
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This progress report will be available and regularly updated in both this original post and in this later post within this thread.

October 28, 2015 update: Discussions begin by HKpro PM and then by phone to purchase a dealer's registered trigger frame. The seller (tracerconnect) is an active gun dealer with a very long history on HKpro.com (Join Date: Feb 2004), AR15.com (Joined: Mar 2002), AK47.net (Joined: Mar 2002), thecmp.org (Join Date 02-24-2010), 1919a4.com (Join Date 03-03-2008), & Gunbroker.com (member since 7/9/2006).
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October 29, 2015 update: Deal made. I agreed to buy this fellow HKpro member's registered HK frame w/ trigger group and we agreed on the price of $30,000.00. I was given the green light to prepare a contract for our deal, which I did. The link to the contract at Google Docs was provided to the dealer to review, sent by email on Thursday 10/29/2015 @ 1:34 PM CST. I was assured that it wouldn't be sold to anyone else and I've had a very pleasant experience dealing with this seller thus far, which is a most welcome contrast when compared to the arduous/taxing, and ultimately disappointing DLO box experiences of the past. I promise to send full payment after I'm provided with actual pictures of what I'm purchasing. The pics are just a formality at this point, a precursor to mailing full payment along with the signed contract to the seller.

October 30th, 2015 update: 6 pictures received by email from the seller. By this point, I was given every confirmation by this dealer that our deal would be honored, as this dealer was made well aware of the remarkably consistent lack of reliability/integrity that I've experienced on the sellers' end for previous deals. We mutually reaffirmed our commitment to this deal, I'm instructed to make payment out to his name (not his business), and now its my turn to send full payment + signed contract. Seller gives me the heads up that he's leaving on Saturday, October 31st (Halloween), to Vegas for a one week vacation. That tells me that there's no point to mail the seller anything by FedEx First Overnight.

October 31st, 2015 update: I'm told that the trigger pack is configured for 2-round burst, but seller offers to drive to the gunsmith Terry Dyer in person to have it converted to 3RB if that's what I preferred. I ask to see his copy of the form 3 for this item, and seller agrees to share it with me. To my surprise, the information was readily instilled in his memory (eidetic memory?), that or the more logical explanation is that he already had the form 3 directly in front of him, as he recited the contents of the form 3 without hesitation when asked for the registered caliber, model, & serial. Seller says that he won't be changing his mind on our deal, offers to provide any help I need with getting the pack to work with my host gun, and even offers a return option if I'm not happy with the trigger pack. I let him know how very grateful I am to be dealing with him and that I can't think of any other questions to ask.

November 3rd, 2015 update: I mailed full payment + 2 copies of signed contract + self addressed prepaid envelope (for sending copy of form 3 and returning one of the two 2-page signed contracts) by USPS First-Class as shown below:
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November 6th, 2015 update: USPS tracking shows delivery to dealer at 3:35 PM CST.
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November 10, 2015 update: At 3:15 PM CST, the dealer confirmed that full payment was received and then he asked for my local dealer's FFL/SOT to complete the form 3 for transfer. I both emailed a scan and snail mailed copies of my local dealer's FFL/SOT same day. I ask if he has any MP5 & MP5K trigger housings with 4-pos 2-rnd burst pictorgrams, and if so, can I buy them. He says he has them and planned to give them to me anyways. I say that just swapping them with the originally included 3-rnd burst trigger housings works for me. I voice concern that my check hasn't been cashed/deposited yet. Dealer says that he wants to provide me with a copy of his form 3 for this item before depositing. I explain that I can't use the funds as they must remain in the account for the check to clear, so you may as well put the funds to use since I can't. Dealer says he's in no hurry and doesn't need the money. I say, "OK, I'll just sit back and wait then."

November 20th, 2015 update: I call the dealer's mobile # at 2:43 PM CST. No answer.

December 1st, 2015 update: I sent the following email to the dealer on Tue 12/1/2015 @ 9:49 PM CST, "Pardon the intrusion, but what’s the status of my order? If you prefer bank wire T/T or PayPal (no fees), I’m willing to send in full and same day of course, which will save you the hassle of depositing the check. If you’re having trouble finding your form 3, I’m willing to fly out and help however I can. As a reminder, while I’d like to have a copy of your form 3 for my records of provenance, your integrity as a long time gun dealer is good enough for me."

December 3rd, 2015 update: Last communication from seller was on November 10th. No sign that the check has been deposited yet as the $30k is still sitting in my account. No copy of seller's form 3 received yet, though that's certainly not my deal requirement as I urged the dealer to deposit my check on November 10th. Besides, the contract doesn't mention the need to see his form 3, its simply something the seller agreed to share with me.

December 4th, 2015 update: I called the dealer's mobile at 7:00 PM CST and he answered. I explained how other sellers had broken HK gun deals with me and I was wondering if that was the situation here. He kindly assured me that he's just been very busy, that he's currently in Phoenix for a gun show, but would take care of my order 1st thing when he returns home. I thanked him graciously and told him that I didn't mind waiting, but considering the time that had passed, I was just paranoid that he had changed his mind. Here's the only gun show in town for Phoenix during the 12/4/15 weekend (this show was in conjunction with SAR West 2015):


December 10th, 2015 update: I noticed this WTB thread had disappeared, and that made me mighty paranoid because I still have pending NFA deals originating from this thread. I immediately contacted the HKpro staff explaining that the 1st and last post of this thread contained detailed records for said pending deals. It was explained to me that all market threads are permanently deleted after 60 days. I explained that for NFA deals, those are kinda impossible to complete within 60 days for us unlicensed folks, so we can't leave feedback, and keeping the threads indefinitely would give us valuable records to reference for the deal history (prices, sources, everything). So, the helpful staff here pulled my WTB thread from backup, restored it to the server, and changed the rules from deleting all market threads after 60 days to never deleting them. To show my gratitude, though such was never asked of me, I immediately registered as a premium member.

December 12th, 2015 update: Still no sign that this order has been processed by the dealer. I reach out to the community for advice and support regarding this disconcerting delay and the sentiment is a mix of astonishment and outrage.

December 17th, 2015 update: As recommended by a fellow HKpro NFA collector, I reach out to an HKpro moderator (diesel1959) to intervene. The staff here takes action same day by contacting the seller by PM with a copy sent to the other HKpro mods/admins. I've been told to do the following, "You need to settle down, scale back and let the deal happen." As advised by the staff, I will refrain from disturbing the dealer and make a better effort of practicing patience. Considering that this deal has already spanned well beyond Halloween & Thanksgiving, watching a couple more holidays pass by will be simple enough (Christmas & New Years). Perhaps the passing of 4 major holidays will provide that elusive window of opportunity for the dealer to file the single page form 3.

December 28th, 2015 update: Had a refreshing 97 minute phone conversation with the dealer this evening. Once again, I was given every assurance that he's still selling his HK trigger pack to me and that he's just had a lot going on. Dealer asks if I can send him two checks for $15k each in exchange for the single $30k check that I had sent on November 3rd (he just informed me that he doesn't want to deposit a single check for $30k). I offer to overnight him two checks but I'm told to hold off and that he will contact me towards the end of this week with an update.

January 8th, 2016 update: I call for an update and the dealer says that he found his form 3 and will be mailing it along with the original $30k check and signed contract back to me. I'm told that he's had this transferable HK trigger frame since 1997! He asks for 3 checks instead of 2 in the amount of $10k each and I'm given the green light to send these new checks. This time I decide to send certified bank cashier's checks mailed by FedEx Priority Overnight + Saturday delivery.
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January 9th, 2016 update:
FedEx tracking shows delivery to dealer at 11:19 AM.
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January 29th, 2016 update: I call the dealer for an update and he said that he hasn't deposited the new checks, returned the 1st check, nor filed the form 3 yet. He says that he will definitely take care of my order next week and will do so by priority mail. He wants to wrap everything up before he goes on another vacation (sea cruise) with his brother.

February 5th, 2016 update: The dealer updates me by text message with USPS Priority Mail Express 2-Day tracking info.

February 6th, 2016 update: Packet delivered. My copy of the signed/completed contract, original $30k check, dealer's original form 3 from 1997, & preliminary form 3 to my FFL are all accounted for on my end. The dealer's form 3 is exactly as he had described and I approved of the purchase. I'm told that he will be leaving for his next vacation in exactly one week from today, but the filing of the form 3 to my local dealer is to proceed next week.
February 12th, 2016 update: The dealer mailed the completed form 3 to the NFA Branch of the Bureau of ATF&E today by Priority Mail® 2-Day delivery and provided me with the tracking info.

February 17th, 2016 update: Form 3 delivered to the ATF. Now the wait officially begins.

HKpro PMs for this deal: 2 from seller, 4 sent from buyer (me)
Emails for this deal: 8 from seller, 8 sent from buyer (me)
Text messages for this deal: 8 from seller, 8 from me buyer (me)

Phone calls for this deal:
October 28th, 2015: 7 minutes 24 seconds
October 29th, 2015: 1 hour 11 minutes
October 30th, 2015: 30 minutes 1 second
October 31st, 2015: 15 minutes 22 seconds
November 10th, 2015: 7 minutes 45 seconds
December 4th, 2015: 6 minutes 44 seconds
December 28th, 2015: 1 hour 37 minutes
January 8th, 2016: 17 minutes 26 seconds
January 29th, 2016: 39 minutes 9 seconds
February 6th, 2016: 36 minutes 22 seconds
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For deal #5:
September 25th, 2015 update: Talks start by HKpro PM for a bundle deal that includes a MP5K-N (SP89) host gun.
*fast forward*
November 11th, 2015 update: Deal made for the full package. Seller provided his PayPal addy @ 10:12 PM. Full payment sent by PayPal friends and family (no fees) at 10:44 PM.
November 24th, 2015 update: Seller says he will visit his local dealer to start the transfer process the week after Thanksgiving.
November 30th, 2015 update: Seller said that he arranged for transfer from his local dealer to mine and that he shipped everything else to me directly that doesn't require a licensed dealer.
December 29th, 2015 update: Seller ships a final missing item, a new 100-rnd Beta C-mag.
December 31st, 2015 update: Final item from bundle deal delivered. Deal complete. Positive feedback left for seller.
 

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Very confusing first post. You would be hard pressed to find anyone sell a DLO box for that much money.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Seriously people? Fine proof that lead poisoning does cause brain damage. This is the WTB forum. If you scroll through the next dozen pages you'll notice that this forum is comprised exclusively of offers to buy: "WTB (Want to Buy)". I felt that including WTB in thread title within the WTB forum was rather redundant and unnecessary. And my account is half a decade old, though I've been a lurker here for much longer. Too bad my PM count doesn't count, otherwise this layer of egg on my face wouldn't be as thick.
 

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Makes much more sense now after you edited your post. Worked in a lead factory for years before taking on a new career. Brain damaged or not the first original post was misleading and plenty of times a day people post in the wrong forum and/or try and get around the post count rule to sell their stuff. Good luck with your purchase and becoming brain damaged like the rest of us mongaloids who have lead poisoning.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Gotcha, not a scam, this post truly does belong in the WTB forum as I'm looking to payout, not get paid. There are many who bought these DLO boxes from Doug for $12k around the time I joined the HK Pro forums after all, and they would double their ROI by taking my offer. I'm only in the market for one (1) trigger box though.
 

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The Librarian
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$35k that's ridiculous and how is it even possible to have a registered Ambi pack... Didn't HK only start making those post '86?
 

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The Librarian
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I was wondering same thing......Maybe he took a DLO and had it converted to 4 position only thing I could come up with......
My thought as well and I see "MTA" on the left side of the pack under the penny. It's not "rare" nor worth more than $25k for taking an SEF pack into 4 pos Ambi. BUT still, it would be nice to have the info on who did the work.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
I called the seller (Curt LaManna of Capital Ordnance) last night about his registered H&K trigger pack and he tells me that 'H&K' supposedly made these only for the police department, that he's had this since the 1980s and that there aren't many of them out there. Curt said they were made/manufactured in this configuration (ambi+burst) by 'H&K' themselves (not a modification), unlike Doug's SEF boxes, and that there were very few in existence. Though Curt's terminology didn't match up, I got the impression that the registered component was the trigger housing/shell because he said that the guts were new and can be swapped out. So, I made an impulse offer of $30k by check and I mail it tomorrow (today). He says Doug has been selling his packs for $30k and Doug is sold out. I say Doug has been selling them for $25k, last time I spoke to him was within the hour and Doug has only ever mentioned $25k to me, but Doug has pulled his supply from the market for now (none available says Doug). Curt says, nope, I saw one of Doug's packs listed for $30k and it sold within minutes. I say list price and sold price are two different things, and that I have a tentative deal to buy an unmodified DLO box installed in a complete host gun for $30k. Curt says he knows about that gun and that it already sold, which I know for a fact isn't the case because I haven't mailed my payment yet nor has the seller told me it was sold. I hold firm to $30k and he basically tells me to go to hell, so I apologized for wasting his time and hang up.

Right, so there's an attorney from Florida selling an MP5K-N in the exact configuration I want(ed) on subguns. Has a DLO trigger box that's been modified for ambi+burst, a build in 2014 by Ralph of RDTS using new SP89, includes five 30 round magazines, and this seller's lowest price was $37k by our negotiations. My best offer was $36k, but I've been advised from numerous sources that $37k was just too steep. The fact that it's still for sale at $38k on subguns for a full 2 months confirms that. Yet somehow Curt LaManna of Capital Ordnance thinks his pack alone is worth $35k and wouldn't acknowledge any of my references to real world and current 'asking prices'. With his pricing logic, its no wonder his pack has remained unsold since 1980. In short, Curt was very curt with me, was either delusional or grossly misinformed, and carries a massive chip on his shoulder, hence my want ad on the forums to see if there be any alternatives out there, or as this discussion has shown, if Curt's offering is something other than he claims (a moded box perhaps).

P.S.: I may just settle with a Fleming or Qualified sear and just avoid the registered trigger box fiasco altogether, would buy with host gun if it's an MP5K, as a 4 position pack, or as sear alone. PM with offer, ty.
 

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The Librarian
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I guess it is possible "1982: A new three round burst trigger group with four settings and a polymer housing is introduced." As per the World of HK.
 

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Unrepentant HKHolic
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I called the seller (Curt LaManna of Capital Ordnance) last night about his registered H&K trigger pack and he tells me that 'H&K' supposedly made these only for the police department, that he's had this since the 1980s and that there aren't many of them out there. Curt said they were made/manufactured in this configuration (ambi+burst) by 'H&K' themselves (not a modification), unlike Doug's SEF boxes, and that there were very few in existence. Though Curt's terminology didn't match up, I got the impression that the registered component was the trigger housing/shell because he said that the guts were new and can be swapped out. So, I made an impulse offer of $30k by check and I mail it tomorrow (today). He says Doug has been selling his packs for $30k and Doug is sold out. I say Doug has been selling them for $25k, last time I spoke to him was within the hour and Doug has only ever mentioned $25k to me, but Doug has pulled his supply from the market for now (none available says Doug). Curt says, nope, I saw one of Doug's packs listed for $30k and it sold within minutes. I say list price and sold price are two different things, and that I have a tentative deal to buy an unmodified DLO box installed in a complete host gun for $30k. Curt says he knows about that gun and that it already sold, which I know for a fact isn't the case because I haven't mailed my payment yet nor has the seller told me it was sold. I hold firm to $30k and he basically tells me to go to hell, so I apologized for wasting his time and hang up.

Right, so there's an attorney from Florida selling an MP5K-N in the exact configuration I want(ed) on subguns. Has a DLO trigger box that's been modified for ambi+burst, a build in 2014 by Ralph of RDTS using new SP89, includes five 30 round magazines, and this seller's lowest price was $37k by our negotiations. My best offer was $36k, but I've been advised from numerous sources that $37k was just too steep. The fact that it's still for sale at $38k on subguns for a full 2 months confirms that. Yet somehow Curt LaManna of Capital Ordnance thinks his pack alone is worth $35k and wouldn't acknowledge any of my references to real world and current 'asking prices'. With his pricing logic, its no wonder his pack has remained unsold since 1980. In short, Curt was very curt with me, was either delusional or grossly misinformed, and carries a massive chip on his shoulder, hence my want ad on the forums to see if there be any alternatives out there, or as this discussion has shown, if Curt's offering is something other than he claims (a moded box perhaps).

P.S.: I may just settle with a Fleming or Qualified sear and just avoid the registered trigger box fiasco altogether, would buy with host gun if it's an MP5K, or just the sear itself. PM with offer, ty.
I would say your offer of 30k was a pretty good/fair offer
 

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I called the seller (Curt LaManna of Capital Ordnance) last night about his registered H&K trigger pack and he tells me that 'H&K' supposedly made these only for the police department, that he's had this since the 1980s and that there aren't many of them out there. Curt said they were made/manufactured in this configuration (ambi+burst) by 'H&K' themselves (not a modification),
If it was made by "H&K themselves" why does he now say "The original builder/registrar was Hard Times Armory, John Farmer"

And what gun do you put this in? There is no shelf notch.

Run Forest, Run.
 

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Dangggg, prices for this stuff are getting out of control! $38k for a converted SP89 and registered box? Time for sear prices to catch back up, damn...
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Dangggg, prices for this stuff are getting out of control! $38k for a converted SP89 and registered box? Time for sear prices to catch back up, damn...
Lets call it what it is tho, it's an out of control asking price of $38k. It has sat unsold for two solid months, just as that $35k HTA trigger pack isn't priced to go to a new home any year soon.
 
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